Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

[Deemi]

I am facing bullying and what I believed overcharging from JBW over an unpaid PCN (£130) issued by a London borough. The notice was issued in September last year for 'failing to comply with a restriction on vehicles entering a pedestrian zone'. I challenged the notice but the LBBD rejected it. Later, the penalty soared to £195 while I was finding ways how to effectively challenge the notice as contravention took place during wee hours and the warning signs were not displayed prominently.

Anyway, the council sent me a payment notice of £202 (including £7 court registration fee) in January this year. Frankly speaking, I didn't have the money to pay and get rid of the situation. LBBD also turned down my request for payment in installments over the phone. At this, I resigned to the fate.

In May, I found a hand-delivered letter among my post. That was an unsigned 'Notice of Attendance' from JBW asking to pay £573.04 immediately to avoid additional costs. The sum included an amount of £499.84 stated as 'Balance before today's visit'. I didn't receive any letter from them before, posted or hand-delivered. I wrote them an email asking for details of the matter, as there was no reference to the original PCN, and breakdown of the amount they were demanding.

I got no response from JBW, meanwhile I received a 'Notice of Removal' from them. A week later, I emailed and posted a 'Subject Access Request' to them along with a cheque of £10. This time I got a reply from them near the end of statutory 40 days response period in June. The breakdown of £573.04 they provided was: Debt, £202.00; Letter Fee, £11.20 + 2.24 (VAT); Attendance to levy 1, £57.00 + £11.40 (VAT); Attendance to levy 2, £61.00 + £12.20 (VAT); Attendance to remove, £175.00 + £35.00 (VAT); and Closing Fee, £5 + £1 (VAT). That means for a recovery of £202 debt they are charging £371.04. All their 'hush hush' visits took place within a week without my knowledge and billed for a mind boggling sum.

I work from home and my place has never been unattended, so I am at loss to make it out that if the JBW bailiffs paid visits why didn't they bother to knock or ring bell to let me know what are they up to?

I didn't make any contact with them hoping against hope that they might get lost but after a gap of five months they now have sent 'Final Notice' demanding £573.04 and if they do not hear from me they will send an enforcement officer to attend my property. The notice also says that my debt will be uploaded to their ANPR database which according to JBW highlights any vehicles that are registered to me to their ANPR fleet. To my knowledge APNR (Automatic Number Plate Recognition) technology can only be used by the police or official security agencies, and even then there are some privacy issues raised about its usage. If I am right then how JBW can threaten somebody under wrong premise?

Someone please help sort out the menace of JBW.

[labman]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

Hi and welcome to Legal Beagles. I'm sorry to hear you're having a tough time with the bailiffs.

Have a read of this:

http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...rking-Offences

and come back with any questions you may have.

In regards to your question about ANPR it is used quite widely now outside of the police, and is certainly used by bailiffs. It would make sense therefore to keep your car parked a few streets away to stop them getting a levy on it.

The link also gives you a clear way forward of challenging it, which you can still do, so please don't worry about that.

[Deemi]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

Thnx Labman ... I've glanced content of the link you gave and found it quite helpful. Can I file a Statutory Declaration with TEC on the basis that I didn't receive Warrant of Execution? And, therefore, a request to revoke the warrants it entrusted to the LA for debt recovery?

[bluebottle]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

Sounds like JBW are up to their fictitious fees number again. I can tell you that it is known LBBD do not issue warrants. So it is likely JBW are acting with total illegality. Ask to see a copy of the warrant from LBBD within 48 hours. I can tell you JBW are under a legal obligation to produce it on demand.

[labman]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

I can tell you JBW are under a legal obligation to produce it on demand.

Not quite. They have to either produce it, or tell you where it can be inspected.

[Deemi]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

I can tell you that it is known LBBD do not issue warrants. So it is likely JBW are acting with total illegality. Ask to see a copy of the warrant from LBBD within 48 hours. I can tell you JBW are under a legal obligation to produce it on demand.

To my 'subject access request' JBW sent an alleged copy of the warrant of execution which I however saw for the first time, although that was addressed to me. It says "prepared on the authority of: the traffic enforcement centre at Northampton county court .." Interesting thing to note is that according to the (copy of) WoE it is issued to the enforcement officer a day before being authorised by the TEC, I don't know whether it's a standard practice.

A note on the WoE says:

• This Warrant can only be enforced by a bailiff carrying a certificate issued by a judge under the Distress for Rent Rules 1998.
• Any enquiry or complaint about the conduct of the bailiff should be addressed to the Court Manager of the county court where the bailiff's certificate was issued (in most cases this will be your local county court and not Northampton County Court where the Parking Enforcement Centre is based). If you are not clear about which court authorised the bailiff's certificate, contact your local county court who will be able to assist you.

But as the WoE didn't reach me until I made the subject access request, I think I have a ground to file statutory declaration FE9 coupled with FE7. What do experts say?

I haven't yet come across the bailiffs, so lodging a complaint against them with the county court which certified them seems to be not an option. Complaints can however be raised against JBW with OFT and CIVEA (Civil Enforcement Association) for extortionate fees and bad practices but for that I probably would have to raise the matter with the company concerned (JBW). Any thought?

But to do this first of all the relevant court, which in this case is TEC, needs to be approached to get the WoE revoked ... am I thinking on right lines???

[bluebottle]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

Not quite. They have to either produce it, or tell you where it can be inspected.

It may say this in some legislation, but anyone, not just scummy certificated bailiffs, issued with a warrant of any description is under an obligation to produce it on demand. Telling someone they can see a warrant at an office is neither good practice or, in many cases, legal. Imagine a bailiff trying to break into an alleged debtor's home and PC Plod comes along, catches him doing this and asks to see lawful authority, i.e. the warrant, for him to break in. If the bailiff cannot produce proof he has lawful authority there and then, he's going for a ride to the local lock-up. Two Ross & Roberts bailiffs tried this earlier this year and got their backsides roundly kicked by the police who asked to see lawful authority. One of the bailiffs had their certificate revoked without a Form 4 complaint being submitted or a hearing. The Judge who read the letter from the alleged debtor and a copy of the police report was not impressed.

[bluebottle]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

To my 'subject access request' JBW sent an alleged copy of the warrant of execution which I however saw for the first time, although that was addressed to me. It says "prepared on the authority of: the traffic enforcement centre at Northampton county court .." Interesting thing to note is that according to the (copy of) WoE it is issued to the enforcement officer a day before being authorised by the TEC, I don't know whether it's a standard practice.

A note on the WoE says:

• This Warrant can only be enforced by a bailiff carrying a certificate issued by a judge under the Distress for Rent Rules 1998.
• Any enquiry or complaint about the conduct of the bailiff should be addressed to the Court Manager of the county court where the bailiff's certificate was issued (in most cases this will be your local county court and not Northampton County Court where the Parking Enforcement Centre is based). If you are not clear about which court authorised the bailiff's certificate, contact your local county court who will be able to assist you.

But as the WoE didn't reach me until I made the subject access request, I think I have a ground to file statutory declaration FE9 coupled with FE7. What do experts say?

I haven't yet come across the bailiffs, so lodging a complaint against them with the county court which certified them seems to be not an option. Complaints can however be raised against JBW with OFT and CIVEA (Civil Enforcement Association) for extortionate fees and bad practices but for that I probably would have to raise the matter with the company concerned (JBW). Any thought?

But to do this first of all the relevant court, which in this case is TEC, needs to be approached to get the WoE revoked ... am I thinking on right lines???

There appears to be an irregularity involving LBBD and JBW and I wouldn't mind betting LBBD have outsourced the issue of warrants to JBW which is potentially illegal, as the relevant legislation confers power to issue warrants to the LA only. I am unaware of any legal provision that would allow an LA to authorise its contracted enforcement agent to issue warrants of execution. This requires further investigation.

[labman]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

I would recommend you post your PCN and other documents here to be looked at (registration is free):

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?

This site concentrates ONLY on motoring offences.

I think you are putting too much stay in the warrant. They only have to show it if you ask to see it. I would have thought you may be better contesting on unclear signage if they are really unclear. I think you will find it very hard to get the WoE revoked, though you can try, and the site above will have come across this many times before, and your WoE and PCN will be looked at by experts.

The problem you face as I see it, is that unless there is something obvious, you have clearly admitted the contravention here. In any case, I would write to the bailiff company using Letter 1 from here:

http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...Useful-Letters

When you receive that, post up again and we will work out any unlawful fees.
Have a read around,and let us know what you decide.

[bluebottle]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

There is an irregularity with the way in which the warrant was issued and, as stated above, I am of the opinion that it strongly implies JBW are issuing WoEs when the law does not allow them to do so. This has the effect of rendering the WoE potentially unenforceable which would raise questions as to the legitimacy of JBW's actions. As also stated, this needs investigating further.

[Deemi]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

There is an irregularity with the way in which the warrant was issued and, as stated above, I am of the opinion that it strongly implies JBW are issuing WoEs when the law does not allow them to do so. This has the effect of rendering the WoE potentially unenforceable which would raise questions as to the legitimacy of JBW's actions. As also stated, this needs investigating further.

I am also of the view that there's something fishy but only the response from relevant authorities, the LA and the TEC, to our queries can help further investigations ... what do you think???

[bluebottle]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

The irregularity is that the warrant was handed to the bailiff one day before Northampton TEC authorised the warrant to be issued. Only a local authority can issue a warrant relating to a PCN, according to the legislation (Enforcement of Road Traffic Debts (Certificated Bailiffs) Regulations 1993-2003). If LBBD had issued the warrant, the bailiff would have received it on or after a date Northampton TEC authorised its issue. What you have posted and have, indeed, found is that there appears to be something highly irregular involving JBW and it is not beyond the bounds of possibility that they may be issuing warrants when the law does not permit them to do so. This raises serious questions as to whether JBW's actions in your case are, indeed, lawful. You may need to speak to the police about this.

[Deemi]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

I think you are putting too much stay in the warrant.

Yes, because JBW's role starts after the WoE and they draw their 'authority' to act from the warrant, which was addressed to me but didn't reach me and on the (copy of) WoE there's no mention of any enforcement company/agency entrusted with the task to execute it. The question arises here is whether it's the responsibility of the LA concerned to send the WoE to the respondent/debtor or the local authority assigns this duty too to the civil enforcement firm? And if latter is the case then the enforcement firm can skip delivering WoE in order to mint money by 'following the procedure starts thereafter', that is, bailiff visits, levying and attendance for removal, etc. Why don't they send the first letter, which costs the debtor £11.20 + VAT, by recorded mail? Don't you think that it be a fair demand to ask both the LA and JBW to provide evidence that whoever of them was supposed to inform the respondent/debtor about the WoE issued by the court against him had mailed it?

Thanks for the link and advice :beagle:

[Deemi]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

Here's the WoE ... you can see the dates highlighted in red and green

[bluebottle]

Re: Is their any respite from bailiffs' tactics and their extortionate fees???

Under the regulations, the LA issues the WoE to the enforcement contractor who is then supposed to send you a letter informing you that a WoE has been issued in respect of the PCN. A warrant is an order from a court empowering a person to do whatever is specified on the warrant.

General Rule with Warrants: Stick to what is specified on the warrant and don't deviate. Otherwise, it will come back and smack you in the face later.

Strictly speaking, JBW should have sent you a letter. If they haven't, they need to explain this. Expect them to insist they have. Ask them to stipulate where and on what date and at what time they posted the letter.