Disciplinary Hearing for Ecig use at Work?

[Vapor5712]

OK, here goes. Been a heavy smoker for many years and managed to get away for smoke breaks for many years also.

Since Dec 2015 I've discovered Ecigs and it's been a revelation to me! Down from 40 odd cigs a day to less than 5!

Always got into work 15mins before shift started and had a couple of fags outside but for the last few months I've taken to sitting inside on top of toilet and 'vaping' for a few minutes. Now I'm not talking huge clouds here, even I as a smoker find them annoying. Just moderate puffs.

Seems like someone at work got offended by the smell of strawberry/cherry at my workplace so a directive went out that ecigs are now forbidden.

Now here's the part where I was a bit of a twat I guess. I had to nip out from my office to see some things in the warehouse area of my workplace and whilst there had a couple of cheeky puffs. Someone saw me and grassed me up to my line manager and now I'm looking at a disciplinary.

I joined this company in 2009 and as far as I knew there was no policy on ecigs but it has since been pointed out to me they are now covered under the company handbook update from 2014. I don't recall ever being notified about this update?

All that aside I think my main beef is that from what I can gather if I want to continue to use ecigs in my aim to give up smoking I must do it in the 'designated smoking area'!

So I have to put myself into an environment to use my 'safe' alternative where people are smoking so that forces me to passive smoke?

I would welcome your thoughts?

[messimoo]

Re: Disciplinary Hearing for Ecig use at Work?

Hi Long time to speak, This Is a topic very close to me as I to am an experienced vaper and our work place also has a no vaping policy also. There is a health and safety directive that clearly states that they need to supply a safe area for vapers to go without being with smokers (think would an alcoholic be surrounded by alcohol when they want to quit, same basic principal). Is there any other vapers in your workplace who you can muster together to push for a seperate vaping area? But please don't vape in non designated areas, not good. A sneaky voop in the loos works 9 times out of 10 but there is always the "office creep",( we have one) who is always on the look out to get people into trouble.

[Ripped-Off]

Re: Disciplinary Hearing for Ecig use at Work?

I am one of the lucky ones. My firm has not yet introduced a policy of no vaping so I am able to vape in work, how cool is that!

Anyway, I do not do it openly. I take a crafty puff here and there during the course of the day. The battery I use is quite small so it hardly generates any 'smoke' at all.

If someone saw you then until they come forward and admit it in a written statement, wouldn't it be a case of your word against theirs. Is it possible to discipline someone on the strength of hearsay! After all, you could have had a pen in your mouth if someone saw from a distance, and until you actually blow out vapour, are you vaping? Is it 'illegal' to put it to your mouth?

[charitynjw]

Re: Disciplinary Hearing for Ecig use at Work?

Hi

If the 'update' was not clear (was it announced to all employees?), it could be challenged, as any change to the employment contract must be by agreement.
It could be argued that, given the length of time since it's introduction, it could be classed as a variation by affirmation, but again, only if the change was made known (ie it can't be 'sneaked' in).
Do your colleagues know all about it?
Btw, this 'disciplinary' - have you been notified in writing, with the necessary info re right to be accompanied, etc?
& how long have you been working for this firm?

[Vapor5712]

Re: Disciplinary Hearing for Ecig use at Work?

Hi

If the 'update' was not clear (was it announced to all employees?), it could be challenged, as any change to the employment contract must be by agreement.
It could be argued that, given the length of time since it's introduction, it could be classed as a variation by affirmation, but again, only if the change was made known (ie it can't be 'sneaked' in).
Do your colleagues know all about it?
Btw, this 'disciplinary' - have you been notified in writing, with the necessary info re right to be accompanied, etc?
& how long have you been working for this firm?

I do not recall anyone saying the policy was updated (in 2014 apparently). Not had letter yet, just verbal notice I'll be getting one. Been there 9 years.
Not asked anyone else so unsure if anyone else knows.

- - - Updated - - -

Hi Long time to speak, This Is a topic very close to me as I to am an experienced vaper and our work place also has a no vaping policy also. There is a health and safety directive that clearly states that they need to supply a safe area for vapers to go without being with smokers (think would an alcoholic be surrounded by alcohol when they want to quit, same basic principal). Is there any other vapers in your workplace who you can muster together to push for a seperate vaping area? But please don't vape in non designated areas, not good. A sneaky voop in the loos works 9 times out of 10 but there is always the "office creep",( we have one) who is always on the look out to get people into trouble.

That's really my main point. As a vaper I am being directed to do it in the normal smoking area.

[charitynjw]

Re: Disciplinary Hearing for Ecig use at Work?

The firm's Disciplinary & Grievance procedures should be accessible & should reflect the ACAS guidance.

[Vapor5712]

Re: Disciplinary Hearing for Ecig use at Work?

The firm's Disciplinary & Grievance procedures should be accessible & should reflect the ACAS guidance.

It's all above board. It's a Ftse100 company after all.

Not looking good though. According to the company handbook (updated 2014 although I don't ever recall being told so) I'm up for gross misconduct as my letter confirms.

Seems such a petty thing after almost 10 years unblemished service.

Hearing is on Tuesday 14th but just want it over with

[Vapor5712]

Re: Disciplinary Hearing for Ecig use at Work?

So this was the result, final written warning. Could have been worse.
Apparently this was 'gross misconduct' so summary dismissal was an option.
Probably best to let sleeping dogs lie put there are some points that I feel are not clear/made clear.

• Throughout it refers to 'smoking'. I don't believe that is correct.
• Regarding the email I received titled 'Smoking Policy - E-Cigarettes'. This was an email from a manager expressing an opinion as far as I was concerned. There was NO mention it was COMPANY policy. (Second attachment).
• They did seem a bit worried when I asked if I should be forced to 'vape' in the 'smoking' area, therefore being forced to passive smoke.

I see no point in appealing. Still have my job

[Vapor5712]

Well, dude that is a really awkward situation. I know it has been like 4 years since you posted this, in case you still active please tell me how this issue was solved.

Hi Chris. It wasn't really solved as such. Took the final warning, stay on my record for a year and I'm still there.
Still no separate area for vapor's though.