Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

[naafi]

Hi All,

I was moving a divan bed base out of my bungalow in September on a very windy day. Gusts of around 60 mph were forecast. The bed had to be got out as a new one was about to be delivered. only a small bungalow so now where to store.
As we took the base out through the front door, the a gust of wind got up and caught it sending it smashing against my next door neighbors car.

My neighbor who is 87 was not very happy and got an quote for a new bonnet as it had badly creased his bonnet. This was going to cost £800.

We contacted our insurance who said to send them the estimate and claim forms etc.
We did all this and were then told by the insurance that our liability insurance part of our home and contents insurance would not cover it as we were NOT liable. They told us that our neighbour should have claimed on his motor insurance and we should have gone through the right channels.

Our neighbor was very ill at the time and still is and had just come home from hospital after technically dying and being brought back. he did not want to claim on his motor insurance as he did not see why he should, as far as he was concerned it was our fault and we did the damage.
We could not make him do some thing he did not want to do.

We ended up paying the bill ourselves. I have sent a copy to our insurance company with my complaint.

I spoke to the insurance company and they are adamant so I have now put in a formal complaint.

Am I right? as technically we were negligent taking it outside on such a very windy day and you could say that we should have postponed moving the bed base until the wind had died down. You could also say that we should have requested that some one move our neighbors car for him just in case, as it is parked opposite our front door on our shared driveway, so was about 5 feet from our door.

I would be most grateful for help with this matter.

Many thanks

[CleverClogs]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

If the insurance company claim it was an 'act of God', claim on your legal costs insurance for the cost of suing the Almighty's agent(s) here on Earth - the Archbishop of Canterbury and that old Kraut in Rome.

[labman]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

If you get nowhere with your complaint, go to the Ombudsman.

[naafi]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

I have to get the full and final reply from the insurance company before the ombudsman will take it on. I am still waiting for that. Looks like it could be a long wait.
The only letter I have had from the insurance company was on the 11th November which says they prefer to deal with complaints via telephone and I should have received a telephone call with regard to my complaint, which they state i would probably have received before the letter. What a JOKE!!! Not heard a word from them. I even emailed them to chase it up and have had no reply to my email either.

I have had a lot of people telling me that I can not claim for it as it was not a deliberate act or negligent, that makes no sense to me. I have been told by well meaning friends that if I threw the bed at his car then I could claim. All seems like none sense to me.

[Gorang]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

Hi naafi

Have a look at your T&C's for the insurance policy and look at the inclusions and more importantly the exclusions

see what is all excluded that the ploicy will NOT cover too see if they included situations like this in there

[naafi]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

Just had a good read of the T/C's.

Under the Occupier's and personal liability It says "We will pay all amounts you or your family legally have to pay for causing: Accidental loss or damage to property which is caused by an accident during the period of insurance.
(a) from your occupation(but not ownership) of the buildings; or (b) in a private role not connected with owning the buildings.

The only exclusion which would be of any relevance but in this case is not relevant is " Injury or damage arising from any deliberate or malicious act.

I can not see any were that this accident would not be covered in the policy booklet.
So I am wondering what my best way forward is?

So glad to find people with a bit of help full advice. Are any of you leaglly trained?

[labman]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

Is there anything in there defining 'Acts of God'?
------------------------------- merged -------------------------------

Are any of you leaglly trained?

I could answer that, but won't as you tend to find out what people do as you get more involved in the site and get to know people. If people are legally trained and want you to know, they will tell you, otherwise they are helping out of the goodness of their heart.

Basically the answer is people come from all walks of life, and it is that vast range of experiences in and out of work, that makes the advice base on here so incredibly valuable.

[naafi]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

Hi Labman,

No nothing about acts of God in that section.

I assume that it is only what is specified in the liability section section that can apply as it is a liability claim and not any other sort of claim.

I am not very good at talking with people or arguing with people on the telephone but should I telephone them and point out what that section say's as so far I have not done that.

[labman]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

Hi Labman,

No nothing about acts of God in that section.

I assume that it is only what is specified in the liability section section that can apply as it is a liability claim and not any other sort of claim.

I am not very good at talking with people or arguing with people on the telephone but should I telephone them and point out what that section say's as so far I have not done that.

NO! Keep everything in writing for the avoidance of doubt. They will say things on the phone to you they would never dare put in writing as you would have no proof of them saying it.

[naafi]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

I don't mean to sound thick, but should I write to them now and inform them of what it states in the T/C's booklet. Making the point that I can see nothing in the T/C's to suggest that this claim would not be covered.

Is the fact that it does not mention acts of god a good thing?

I must sound dumb but I have never had a problem like this before.

[labman]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

You don't sound dumb at all! Everyone comes here with questions needing answering and situations they haven't come across. For many of us it's how we got involved and developed an interest in the first place.

Can I make a suggestion - draft a letter and post it up here so that people can look at it and suggest any amendments, if any need making.

That way, you know what goes off to the insurance company is pretty good. :beagle:

[naafi]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

I have basically made it short and sweet.


Dear Sir or Madam,


Policy no:------------
Claim ref:--------

With regard to my recent complaint about your refusal to pay out on my claim,
I have been reading my policy T/C's booklet very carefully and would like to bring to your attention the section on page 33, para 22, which is with reference to Occupiers and personal Liability.
In this section it states "We will pay all amounts you or your family legally have to pay for causing accidental loss of or damage to property which is caused by an accident happening during the period of insurance".
I have carefully checked the exclusions also and there are no relevant exclusions in this case.
I can therefore see no reason for you to refuse payment of this claim.

Yours sincerely

[labman]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

That look sfine to me, but PLEASE wait for others to confirm this and let them have a read of it.

I agree that a short, simple approach is often best.

[Gorang]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

Did you give the insurance anything in writing saying what happened?

if you did can you post that up to the best you remember if you didn't keep a copy

If you didn't then I would also add a bit to the letter saying what happened

ie carrying the bed , one person "slipped" and the "bit of wind there was" gave the bed momentum and the bed damaged the the car which was just a few feet away as it is a shared drive,

Also add a part that the insurance person said it was an act of god, you contend that, as it was you that was liable, as in hind sight, you should of asked for the car to be moved first, before you moved the bed

sumit along that lines

Paint everything as black a pic as you can but, DON'T, over do the wind bit, this way you remove the back doors from the insurance company for them to say it was an act of god

I'm sure you'll get the idea lol

Post up again and we can take a look if you wish


Hope that helps for now

[naafi]

Re: Insurance say I am not liable so they won't pay

Just had a letter today from Tesco insurance which basically says,

" In order that we may offer any further consideration to the liability claim against you, we will require a statement from the third party and their insurers, detailing the nature and extent of the damage sustained to your neighbours car".

I think I may be able to get a statement of what happened as far as my neighbours are concerned from them, even if I have to write it myself and just get them to read it to confirm it is correct and then ask them to sign it. But they never went through any insurance of their own as they did not want to and we could not force them to, so that bit is a NO NO.
My neighbour as I said is 87 years old and is now a very poorly old man so really does not want the hassle.

Do you think a statement from them will be enough. I do not see what else I can offer my insurance company.

I will try to find the original statement to my insurance company as it is on my computer some where and post it.