Parking Private Land

[ostell]

OK how about page 2 of the PCN?

That sign is a forbidding sign. Where is the sign that says enter VRM on the keyboard inside?

For a forbidding sign the sign is offering parking for permit holders only. Here's some text I saved about this whi h will go into the defence.

The signage in the car park is of a “forbidding” nature. It is limited to cars displaying a valid permit only and therefore the terms cannot apply to cars without a permit because the signage does not offer an invitation to park on certain terms. The terms are forbidding. This means that there was never a contractual relationship. I refer you to the following case law: PCM-UK v Bull et all B4GF26K6 [2016], UKPC v Masterson B4GF26K6[2016], Horizon Parking v Mr J C5GF17X2 [2016] – In all three of these cases the signage was found to be forbidding and thus only a trespass had occurred and would be a matter for the landowner.

[gewag]

OK how about page 2 of the PCN?

That sign is a forbidding sign. Where is the sign that says enter VRM on the keyboard inside?

For a forbidding sign the sign is offering parking for permit holders only. Here's some text I saved about this whi h will go into the defence.

The signage in the car park is of a “forbidding” nature. It is limited to cars displaying a valid permit only and therefore the terms cannot apply to cars without a permit because the signage does not offer an invitation to park on certain terms. The terms are forbidding. This means that there was never a contractual relationship. I refer you to the following case law: PCM-UK v Bull et all B4GF26K6 [2016], UKPC v Masterson B4GF26K6[2016], Horizon Parking v Mr J C5GF17X2 [2016] – In all three of these cases the signage was found to be forbidding and thus only a trespass had occurred and would be a matter for the landowner.

There was no page 2 only standard bumf on the back page

[gewag]

There was no page 2 only standard bumf on the back page

I have to pop out for half hour are you happy to resume conversation then ? thank you

[des8]

what does this mean ?

Instructions to Ostell on where to find your pics!

[ostell]

It's the "standard bumf" we need to see. Does it comply with POFA?

[gewag]

OK how about page 2 of the PCN?

That sign is a forbidding sign. Where is the sign that says enter VRM on the keyboard inside?

For a forbidding sign the sign is offering parking for permit holders only. Here's some text I saved about this whi h will go into the defence.

The signage in the car park is of a “forbidding” nature. It is limited to cars displaying a valid permit only and therefore the terms cannot apply to cars without a permit because the signage does not offer an invitation to park on certain terms. The terms are forbidding. This means that there was never a contractual relationship. I refer you to the following case law: PCM-UK v Bull et all B4GF26K6 [2016], UKPC v Masterson B4GF26K6[2016], Horizon Parking v Mr J C5GF17X2 [2016] – In all three of these cases the signage was found to be forbidding and thus only a trespass had occurred and would be a matter for the landowner.

OK thank you ! So how would I word this into my defense could you give me a rough draft or Idea how to proceed I am pretty clueless regarding these matters kind regards

[gewag]

I found this could this be a template for my case ?

1.The Defendant received the claim ***** from the Northampton County Court issued ***********
2.Each and every allegation in the Claimants statement of case is denied unless specifically admitted in this Defence.
3. The signage in the car park is of a “forbidding” nature. It is limited to cars displaying a valid permit only and therefore the terms cannot apply to cars without a permit because the signage does not offer an invitation to park on certain terms. The terms are forbidding. This means that there was never a contractual relationship. I refer you to the following case law: PCM-UK v Bull et al B4GF26K6 [2016], UKPC v Masterson B4GF26K6 [2016], Horizon Parking v Mr J C5GF17X2 [2016] – In all three of these cases the signage was found to be forbidding and thus only a trespass had occurred and would be a matter for the landowner.
In the case of UKPC v Masterson B4GF26K6 [2016];
“I am not able to consider that that is an open offer to contract to park at first sight. If anything, it prohibits unauthorised parking on my reading of it. If I am wrong in that then I have to consider whether the inclusion of the wording, “Terms of parking apply at all times”, in any way invalidates my view that the signage seeks to prohibit unauthorised parking.
Taken from the transcript of PCM-UK v Bull et al B4GF26K6 [2016];
“This notice is an absolute prohibition against parking at any time, for any period, on the roadway. It is impossible to construct out of this in any way, either actually or contingently or conditionally, any permission for anyone to park on the roadway. All this is essentially saying is you must not trespass on the roadway.

15.Under Civil Procedure Rule 16.5 (4) Where the claim includes a money claim, a defendant shall be taken to require that any allegation relating to the amount of money claimed be proved unless he expressly admits the allegation. Therefore, it is expected that the Claimant be required to prove the allegation that the money is owed as claimed.
16.The Defendant respectfully requests the court orders the Claimants to provide the necessary documentation in order for The Defendant to fully plead his case else the Claim should stand struck out.
17.In the event that the relevant documents are received from the Claimant, the Defendant will then be in a position to amend his defence, and would ask that the Claimants bear the costs of the amendment.
18.It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief as claimed or at all.
Statement of Truth
The Defendant believes that the facts stated in this Defence are true.
Signed ________________________________
Dated ________________________________

[gewag]

ac3451f9-c9fd-48f4-8f36-f7dc40f59af3.jpg

It's the "standard bumf" we need to see. Does it comply with POFA?

this is the back of PCN

[ostell]

Do you understand what you have written? Get in that the signage is not in normal view, ie hidden as you say.

So what's on the back of the PCN? What does it say on the other sign referred to? Sheesh, it's like pulling teeth

[gewag]

Do you understand what you have written? Get in that the signage is not in normal view, ie hidden as you say.

So what's on the back of the PCN? What does it say on the other sign referred to? Sheesh, it's like pulling teeth

Forgive me I am a bit thick lol I work with my hands not my brain so a bit lacking. BTW Sheesh is a nice restaurant near me

Ah!

"Where is the sign that says enter VRM on the keyboard inside?"

This sign is on the doorway going into the shop that is tucked around the corner from memory it says please put in your vehicle details to park

[ostell]

It's not BUMF. it was compliance with POFA. and they got it right. But you didn't know that did you?

The sign that says "permit Holders Only" says "see car park signs for terms and conditions" Were there additional signs in the car park with terms and conditions?

Was the sign that says enter VRM also locked inside the shop so you couldn't see it when closed?

Need the FULL story to work out a defence. You only get one chance at it.

[gewag]

It's not BUMF. it was compliance with POFA. and they got it right. But you didn't know that did you?

The sign that says "permit Holders Only" says "see car park signs for terms and conditions" Were there additional signs in the car park with terms and conditions?

Was the sign that says enter VRM also locked inside the shop so you couldn't see it when closed?

Need the FULL story to work out a defence. You only get one chance at it.

Ok I will drive there tomorrow and take photos of any signs I see and talk again to the shop and see if they can get the court action stopped I will post findings tomorrow thank you!

[gewag]

Ok I will drive there tomorrow and take photos of any signs I see and talk again to the shop and see if they can get the court action stopped I will post findings tomorrow thank you!

I have been back to the yard and took some more photos The entrance has a new permit holders sigh that was not there when I got the PCN the office has a terminal to enter vehicle details in the office so you can park there is a a banner in reception to ask have you registered,this is Impossible if the shop is shut and it was when i was there and there is a sign with terms and conditions, I spoke with the harbor master and asked him to get the court action stopped and he replied I will ask the parking co if they will cancel Thursday so will know then Kind regards https://imgur.com/a/eyGiHCE

[ostell]

Just in case it would be nice to get a readable copy of the terms and conditions

[gewag]

Just in case it would be nice to get a readable copy of the terms and conditions

This is the only terms and conditions I could find around the yard or in the shop and you must register seems the only terms and if you don't you will get fined but you cant if the shop is shut and no barriers to stop you entering the yard out of hours but these terms apply at all times ?
All pictures are on here https://imgur.com/a/eyGiHCE