Multiple NCP Parking Charge Notices APNR

[starlord]

Hi - I use 'park and tube' to make automatic parking payment at a NCP London Underground car park which has Automatic Number Plate Recognition installed. Everything worked well until I changed my car last December. I thought I'd set up the new car in the 'park and tube' system and carried on parking, but apparently didn't do it correctly. At the end of Jan I received my first PCN (£100 or £60 within 14 days), have since had another 4 and am possibly exposed to a further 13 PCNs. I've appealed the 5 I've received, receiving 2 appeal rejections to date. Potentially exposed to £1800 in PCN's if I appeal to POPLA which seems excessive to me for 1 'mistake' - any help to resolve would be much appreciated.

[ostell]

so what was the process to change the VRM registered with their system? Did the system accept the change without problem and is money still being taken from you?

[starlord]

Hi Ostell - the process was to add the new vehicle reg and activate the car in their system, which I did OK. However there was a 2nd part of the process to activate the new vehicle at the specific car park, which I didn't do correctly - I can't remember if I tried and failed though. Checking my records, no money was taken between 16th Dec and 30th Jan - I activated the vehicle correctly on 30th Jan when I was investigating the first PCN I received and money has been taken correctly since then. The 'park and tube' system is not showing any outstanding payments for the period in question.

[ostell]

I would suggest thatt hteir system had an error and give you no indication that it had failed.

[starlord]

Thanks Ostell - would that be in my appeal to POPLA, or with regard to appealing specific PCN's as and when I receive them?

[starlord]

and just to follow up on above - so far my appeals are per PCN, but I feel that there is 1 root cause for them all - do I continue treating each PCN individually or try and approach them collectively?

[ostell]

Normally treat PCN individually. You are costing NCP everytime.

Is this railway land and do they know the driver on each occasion (they know the keeper from contacting the DVLA).

If it's railway land then they can't use POFA to claim from the keeper.

[starlord]

Yes - the car park is on railway land.

It is a lease car from a company car scheme, where I am registered as the keeper. Perhaps in error I didn't keep the exact wording from appeal for my first PCN, but from memory I believe I stated I was the driver, or at least implied that. On the appeals for subsequent PCNs I did not state or imply that I was the driver.

[ostell]

Having a lease car introduces an entirely new argument. Has the driver been identified? The fact that they have said that you were named as the driver by the lease company is irrelevant, they were not there and do not know who was driving.

First no keeper liability as it is not relevant land under POFA.

Even if it was relevant land then they have not included the required document with the notice to hirer [have they?]

[starlord]

Sorry, just checked the PCNs - i thought i was the keeper, but they state that the registered keep has identified me as the hirer/driver, so the PCN's are 'notice to driver/hirer'. the company policy allows for my spouse to drive the car, any other drivers need to be added as an additional driver

[ostell]

The registered keeper has identified you as the Hirer/keeper. They cannot identify you as the driver as they were not there at the time. As the hirer you are the keeper of the car at the time, just not the registered keeper.

In your situation there are 4 entities: Registered Keeper (the lease company), Keeper (you), Hirer (you) and Driver. They can all be separate entities.

[starlord]

ah, that makes sense - thanks. One of the requirements stated on the PCN is "If you were not the driver, provide us with the full name of the driver of the vehicle and their current address where a notice can be served on them. (You are also required to pass this notice to the driver.)" I'm assuming that I'm not under any legal obligation to do that so can ignore, is that correct?

[ostell]

So did you get copies of the hire agreement with each PCN? Probably not.

If that's the case then your response would be:

Sirs

Ref PCN xxxxx VRM yyyyyy

I am the hirer/keeper of the above vehicle and am in receipt of the PCN you issued.

I have no liability on this matter as this is not relevant land as described in Schedule 4 of The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA)

Even if it was relevant land I still have no liability on this matter as you have failed to meet the requirements of POFA namely, but not limited to, failing to supply the additional documents mandated by section 14 (2) (a) of the Act. You cannot therefore transfer liability from the driver at the time to me, the hirer keeper..

There is no legal requirement to identify the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.

Any further communication with me on this matter, apart from confirmation of no further action and my details being removed from your records, will be considered vexatious and harassment. This includes communication from any Debt Collection companies you care to instruct.

Yours etc.

Leave the response as long as possible so that they don't get wind of it and send some out correctly.

[starlord]

Thanks Ostell - that's correct, no copies of the hire agreement with any of the PCNs.

Thanks for the response wording, much appreciated. So I'm clear, in the instances where my appeal has been rejected already, should I follow up with this? and for any additional PCN's should I use this for my appeal wording?

Does the above mean that I do not need to appeal to POPLA where my appeal is already rejected or should I do that anyway?

[ostell]

Always appeal to POPLA if they give you the code. Not relevant land and not conforming to POPLA. It costs them every time.