Outstanding Interim Accounts

[Teyeagle]

Background:
My Mother died in Oct 2023 and she had a fairly simple legacy including a home to sell. The house sold in Nov 2024.
My Mother, under coercion changed her will days before she passed to give 2/3 to my sister as opposed to a 50/50 split. As my sister was actively using my mothers bank and credit cards for her own benefit before she passed, we are obviously very keen to see the probate interim accounts. For context, my mothers bank account was emptied of a five figure sum the day after she passed by my sister.
My sister has appointed a well-known legal firm to carry out probate and since before Christmas 2024 we have been expecting to receive said interim accounts and had been led to believe we would see them, by the solicitors, prior to Christmas. One item of note, was that my mother incurred a CCJ for an unpaid debt before she passed and as I am aware, this debt has still not been settled.
I have recently received yet another non-committal email from the lawyers about the whereabouts of the interim accounts and now wondering if I can exert any leverage upon them to divulge the accounts? I have previously used solicitors in this matter and I don’t wish, at this point, to re-appoint them….. Thoughts and advice welcomed

[Pezza54]

Hi
Welcome to LB

How do you know your sister emptied your mother's bank account the day after she died?

Even if your sister is a named executor in the will. probate would not have been granted so she had no right to remove money

You should contact the bank to let them know the date your mother died and they may carry out an investigation involving the transfer of money from the account

Please read "Complaints in focus: Wills and Probate" at www.legalombudsman.org.uk
You could contact this organisation to find out whether you have grounds to make a complaint. If the estate is straight forward and the property sold then the executor should be able to complete administration within a year (the executor's year)

[Teyeagle]

Thanks Pezza for your reply,

1) we know that funds were removed from sight of bank statements.
2) yes, agreed she had no right but she had been helping herself to her mothers accounts for some time.
3) we contacted the bank and they weren’t bothered unless we hadn’t reported it to the authorities, which we did, over 15 months ago, but to be honest they have shown little interest in addressing this. We have a crime reference number also.
4) we as a family, just want to know the best way to bring this matter to conclusion but first, we need them to divulge the facts about the estate.

[PallasAthena]

It seems from your post that your sister is the sole executor and the solicitor is not an executor. The solicitor has been appointed by your sister to act for her in estate administration. Is that the case?

If so then the solicitor is under no duty to disclose anything to you. The solicitor's primary duty is to his client, your sister, and he can only disclose anything to you with your sister's permission. So any legal action you take would need to be against your sister not the solicitor.

You could consider applying for an Inventory and Accounts Order. The only reservation I have about this is that although there is a well established legal right for residuary beneficiaries to be given the final estate accounts I don't know if that right exists for interim accounts. Have you been advised that you have a right to the interims?

https://www.human-law.co.uk/_cmroot/...questions.aspx

Anything your sister did before your mother died was not in her capacity as Executor and Estate accounts will not help you, they will only start from date of death. I am not surprised the bank has declined to investigate as there seems to be no evidence that she withdrew money (before your mother died) without your mother's permission. Your mother was entitled to give her money to your sister if she wanted to (assuming no mental capacity issues).

A police crime reference number is just an administrative procedure, not evidence that police agree a crime has taken place.

An executor is allowed to administer the estate from date of death before probate is granted so withdrawing the money from your mother's account and moving it somewhere else is not a crime. Banks are entitled to refuse the executor access until probate is granted but can allow access at their discretion (up to a certain limit), as they have done here.

What your sister has done with the money might be unlawful or improper (which should be evident from the accounts when you get them) but on the face of it there was nothing illegal about her withdrawing it. Executors routinely move money from the bank accounts of the deceased shortly after their death and put it into accounts under the Executor's control long before Probate is granted. I did that every time I have been an Executor.

[Pezza54]

By relaxing rules regarding the deceased's bank accounts before probate, banks have been responsible for partly causing the problems with potential fraud, misappropriation of the deceased's money, they are now facing
I was an executor twice, both times over 10 years ago, and I was only allowed to withdraw money from the deceased account for funeral expenses without probate

[Pezza54]

Was your mother registered for online banking and your sister was using your mother's password, codes etc to access the account to make payments and transfers?
If not was she named as the second account holder to use a bank card?
Either way your sister should not have been allowed by the bank to withdraw/transfer such a large sum of money one day after the account holders death
The death certificate would not have been available this quick
The bank must now be aware of the actual date of the account holders death and should be or should have carried out an investigation how the money was removed from the account without a copy of the death certificate

It is possible the solicitor appointed executor is having a problem accounting for such a large sum of money taken from the estate account, The estate is valued at the date of death so should include the money that was withdrawn or transferred after the death

[Teyeagle]

I notified the bank to try and ring fence my mothers estate and although my sister was accessing my mothers accounts via online applications they were not interested in my concerns. Having previously worked in banking I must admit the attitude of the bank was very disappointing.

some great advice and information here, ultimately until the executor decides to release the interim accounts then I will just have to wait, possibly indefinitely!

[PallasAthena]

My Mother, under coercion changed her will days before she passed to give 2/3 to my sister as opposed to a 50/50 split.

I don't think anyone has commented on this from your first post so far.

Have you considered challenging the change to Will on grounds of undue influence? Search for 'changing will under coercion england' and dozens of solicitors' sites explain the law.

Whether the Will can be challenged depends mainly on whether you can prove coercion. It would need a lawyer with expertise in this area to review the available evidence.

[Pezza54]

I notified the bank to try and ring fence my mothers estate and although my sister was accessing my mothers accounts via online applications they were not interested in my concerns. Having previously worked in banking I must admit the attitude of the bank was very disappointing.

some great advice and information here, ultimately until the executor decides to release the interim accounts then I will just have to wait, possibly indefinitely!

Don't forget the Legal Ombudsman post 2

[PallasAthena]

Don't forget the Legal Ombudsman post 2

Has OP confirmed whether the solicitor is a named Executor or only appointed by the Executor (OP's sister) to act for her in estate adminstration? That will make a difference to whether the legal ombudsman can act on a complaint from OP as according to the legal ombudsman's site "We can't help you with a complaint about somebody else's service provider".

[Pezza54]

Has OP confirmed whether the solicitor is a named Executor or only appointed by the Executor (OP's sister) to act for her in estate adminstration? That will make a difference to whether the legal ombudsman can act on a complaint from OP as according to the legal ombudsman's site "We can't help you with a complaint about somebody else's service provider".

Please read the first paragraph on page 5 of the article mentioned in post 2
A beneficiary who is not a client of the regulated service provider that is administering the estate as executor can refer a complaint to the legal ombudsman

[PallasAthena]

This paragraph? I don't think it says anything about a beneficiary being able to refer a complaint to the legal ombudsman but I may be wrong. And it seems to me to be solely about the law firm's fees not their services.

Still, nothing to be lost by OP making a complaint - LO can only say 'Not in our remit'

"In addition, service providers should consider that beneficiaries are directly affected by costs even if they are not usually a client of the service provider. It would be prudent, then, if firms - particularly where they are also the executor - aimed to provide costs information to residuary beneficiaries at the start of a case, even if they are not technically the client."

It would be helpful for the thread if OP could clarify whether the solicitor is an Executor and who the Executors are.

[Pezza54]

Sorry I meant to add more in my post about page 5 in later paragraphs

Delays by the executor are mentioned and Mr. C a beneficiary's son referred a complaint about a regulated executor causing a long delay that the LO upheld

[PallasAthena]

In the case of Mr C the solicitor was also the Executor so owed a direct duty to all beneficiaries, which I don't think is the case here but await OP's clarification.

250121-willwriting-report-final-141016-3.pdf

As I said earlier no harm in OP submitting a comaplaint to Legal Ombudsman but he will need to first submit a formal complaint to the solicitors and get their response.

[Teyeagle]

Further Background:
My Sister arranged for a will writer to visit my mother in hospital 10 days before she passed. Although we have seen the will writers background checks we had also seen my mothers’ medical records where on 2 occasions at around the same time the hospital consultant stated that my mother lacked capacity.
From this information, we put in place a caveat to try and bring both parties to arbitration. Apparently, the caveat was challenged by my sister through her appointed executors, without our knowledge (unregistered letter lost in post) and from there, we lost our bargaining position i.e. to return to the previous will 50/50 split with amounts to grandchildren (this format of will 50/50 had been the basis for all my parents’ previous wills.
From there, Probate was granted, and although we did suggest a return to the previous 50/50 split, this was dismissed. From discussions with my solicitor, it was decided to therefore give up our claim and move on (there is more to life).
As my mothers’ home has been sold and stripped of all contents including jewellery and antiques (we have seen the value through the probate report). We just need to see the estate accounts so that we can see what has exactly gone on.