Parking Charge Notice advice please...

[andyb000!]

My son again - second parking ticket in as many weeks - this time a Penalty Charge Notice issued by North Herts District Council for '93 Parked in car park when closed'

This is in the Biggin Lane Car Park behind the Sun Hotel, Hitchin. The hotel car park was full but my son and his girlfriend were led to believe by the hotel staff that it was ok to park in the council car park immediately behind the hotel as they were staying overnight. The staff took the car details.

Next morning they find two parking attendants by the car about to issue a ticket. My son explains that they are guests at the hotel, which the first attendant accepts and it sounds like that's ok. The other attendant then steps in and says that the hotel should have told them to remove the car by 6am, as the car park is for market trader permit holders only on a Saturday, and issues them with a £50 ticket.

I've had a look at Google street level view for Biggin Lane and there is a sign at the entrance to the car park which states in large letters (and I quote) "Market Trader Permit Holders ONLY ON SATURDAYS Normal Parking Will Apply On All Other Days"

Now call me Captain Pernickity but this looks to me as if it could be read a number of ways - including 'Market Trader Permit Holders can only park here on Saturdays'

In any case there's apparently no mention of 'the 6am rule'

Is there any case for challenging the ticket? As it's a Penalty Charge Notice issued by a local authority I assume it's not to be ignored?

Over to you guys :fingers crossed:

Thanks in anticiaption

Andy

[bluebottle]

Re: Parking Charge Notice advice please...

Hi Andy and welcome to Legal Beagles.

I would be inclined to go through the appeals process of the local authority involved. If there was no sign stating when the parking restriction applies, then that may be grounds for appeal. I would certainly stress the conduct of the jobsworth who issued a ticket regardless and who should have used his discretion and commonsense. Best of luck.

[andyb000!]

Re: Parking Charge Notice advice please...

How does this sound for a challenge letter?

"Dear ++++ Parking Enforcement

Challenge to Penalty Charge Notice issued for
'93 Parked in car park when closed'

PCN No: HC++++++++ - Date Isued: 18/08/2012 – Registration: ++++++
__________________________________________________ ___________

This concerns the ****** **** Car Park behind the *** Hotel, ***** and I wish to challenge the issue of the above PCN as being unfair due to misinformation and also signage open to multiple interpretation.

I arrived with my girlfriend on the evening of Friday 17^th August having booked to stay overnight at the hotel following a wedding reception.

The hotel car park was full, but we were told by the hotel staff that it was ok to park in the ****** **** Council car park immediately behind the hotel as we were staying at the hotel overnight. The staff took the car details which led us to believe that there was some sort of an arrangement in place.

Next morning we go down to the car to find two parking enforcement officers by the car about to issue a ticket. We explain that we are guests at the hotel, which the first officer accepts and it appears that all is ok. The other officer then steps in and says that the hotel should have told us to remove the car by 6am, (which they did not do) as the car park is ‘for market trader permit holders only on a Saturday’. We are then issued with a £50 ticket to which we protest but to no avail.

[picture of car park sign]

We would like you to take the following into account:

• Although there is a sign at the entrance to the car park which states in large letters "Market Trader Permit Holders ONLY ON SATURDAYS Normal Parking Will Apply On All Other Days" this is not that helpful.

• What the sign should rather say is that there is ‘No public parking on Saturdays’ – it doesn’t.

• This sign could in fact be interpreted a number of ways - including 'Market Trader Permit Holders can only park here on Saturdays and not on other days'.

• Neither is there any mention of 'the 6am rule'.

• There were still a large number of spaces available so it’s not as if we were denying a market trader a space in the car park for their market vehicle.
• It seems to me also that '93 Parked in car park when closed' is not correct as the car park was in fact open for parking.

We submit that the car park signage is open to interpretation, a member of your staff agreed that there was an acceptable arrangement in place for residents of the +++ Hotel, however we were misinformed as to what that agreement actually was, but took it on good faith that we could park there, and therefore the PCN should not have been issued in these circumstances.

I request that PCN No: HC******* be cancelled.

I look forward to a positive response from yourselves.

Yours truly, etc etc"

Grateful for any thoughts?

[bluebottle]

Re: Parking Charge Notice advice please...

The main ground for appeal is the fact that there is signage which is ambiguous and open to interpretation and makes no mention of any 6 am rule, which makes you wonder if it was something the Parking Stazi made up as he went along. If they want to enforce such a provision, it must be clearly displayed.

Ask to examine a copy of the Off-Street Parking Order for that particular car park. If there is no provision, then the ticket has to be cancelled. If there is a provision, technically, the ticket is good, but because the provision has not been clearly displayed at the car park, the local authority is on unsafe ground.

Good luck with the appeal.

[andyb000!]

Re: Parking Charge Notice advice please...

Thanks BB - I'll make some adjustments

[andyb000!]

Re: Parking Charge Notice advice please...

Amended letter posted

We'll see what happens

Fingers crossed for a positive outcome

[andyb000!]

Re: Parking Charge Notice advice please...

Well a response from the council's Parking Services by return - but not the one we were hoping for:

"The [PCN] was correctly issued. Your car was parked in [x] Car park when it was closed to the public because it is for the sole use of market trader permit holders only. There are signs showing these restrictions which you yourself state are in "Large Letters". You state that the signs are unhelpful but they clearly show "Market Trader Permit Holders Only on Saturdays" [sic] and as you did not display a Market Trader Permit, the [PCN] was issued to your vehicle. The onus is on the driver of the vehicle to observe and adhere to any restriction signs in place.

"You state that you were told by the hotel staff that it was OK for you to park in [the Car Park] and that you were led to believe that there was some sort of arrangement in place. [The council] do not have any arrangement with [the Hotel] in this regard, so this is something that you should take up with the hotel. I have spoken with the Civil Enforcement Officer who confirmed that she did not give you any indication that there was an arrangement between [the council] and the hotel.

"Therefore, after careful consideration of the circumstances I have found no grounds for the cancellation of the charge. You can still take advantage of the discounted charge of £25 if you pay within 14 days of this letter."

As a parallel to this I also contacted the Plain English Commission, whose Research Director is collecting examples of poorly designed/worded signs in private car parks around the country. Although his main interest is Private Car Parks he did reply as follows:

"The sign is ambiguous, so I think it’s worth appealing the decision. As it’s a local-council car park, you can eventually appeal to the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, which is independent. Please let me know how the case turns out..[..]
Thanks for the photo and explanation. Though I’m mainly interested in private car parks, it’s a good case for me."

So, the process now seems to be to either pay at the reduced rate (£25 within the next 14 days - one presumes these are calendar days) and put it down to life.

Or, as we have two witnesses to what was said, challenge the version confirmed by the Civil Enforcment Officer. Additionally, as I appear to now have an expert opinion as to the sign being misleading, pursue this further as well?

Is there any point in contacting the hotel? Is the Council hinting that as my son was apparently mislead by the hotel staff that they should be asked to pay the PCN?

Any further thoughts?

regards

Andy

[alham]

Re: Parking Charge Notice advice please...

I think for what it's worth that it is worth pursuing this further - if I was reading the sign I would have understood it as "MT permit works only on Sat, other days, even if you are in possession of MT permit be a good boy and buy a ticket."

[bluebottle]

Re: Parking Charge Notice advice please...

How the law would look at the wording on the signage is "How would any reasonable person interpret the wording on the signage?" It is no good the local authority claiming that the PCN was issued correctly. It is up to them to prove it was issued correctly. An appeal to the Traffic Penalty Tribunal would, in my opinion, be worth it, if only to clarify the matter of the wording on the signage. If the TPT does rule in your favour, the local authority would then have to change the wording on the signage so that it was clearer as to when people could park there and under what circumstances a PCN could be legitimately issued.