PCN on MY allocated parking space!!! - won

[mystery1]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

Contract, signs etc

M1

[Carmin]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

I did post a picture of the sign myself. Don't know if it was appropriate. I seemed so as I was talking about it. Is it still winnable if they lodge evidence or is it a bad sign?

[mystery1]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

It's winnable. You have paperwork that says the land belongs to you (more accurately you have rights to).

You are under no obligation to use a permit and have not placed that requirement upon yourself.

M1

[Carmin]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

Hi all,

Just to let you know that I received this morning the "counter act" of popla. I can't really look now so I hope I will have a few minutes tonight to send you the files

Carmin

[Carmin]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

Evening all,

I attach the file now. They seem rather sure of themselves but I suppose they would be. Of course they had to wait for the Easter time to send it...
Let me know what you make of it, I don't see any new grounds on their part. They have attached a witness statement concerning the contract which I though M1 was quite against, if I remember well?

Thanks again for your help!

[mystery1]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

I'll get back to you later this week.

M1

[mystery1]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

I would like to respond to the operators evidence as follows :-

The operator concedes that i am a tenant with an allocated space as per my lease. "As this is her allocated space and she is a tenant ofthe site"

The operator has produce a series of pictures of signs. These do not comply with the BPA code.



The code of practice states


“18.2 Entrance signs play an important part in establishing a parking contract and deterring trespassers. Therefore, as well as the signs you must have telling drivers about the terms and conditions for parking, you must also have a standard form of entrance sign at the entrance to the parking area. Entrance signs must tell drivers that the car park is managed and that there are terms and conditions they must be aware of. Entrance signs must follow some minimum general principles and be in a standard format. The size of the sign must take into account the expected speed of vehicles approaching the car park, and it is recommended that you follow Department for Transport guidance on this. See Appendix B for an example of an entrance sign and more information about their use. A standard form of entrance sign must be placed at the entrance to the parking area. There may be reasons why this is impractical, for example: • when there is no clearly defined car park entrance • when the car park is very small • at forecourts in front of shops and petrol filling stations • at parking areas where general parking is not permitted”


“If one of the following standard wordings applies to your parking
area you should use it. If not, you may alter the wording to fit the
situation. Words in square brackets may be left out.
There must be at least one item from Group 1. But no more
than three items from Group 1 should appear before, and more
prominently than, text from Group 2. You must always mention
that terms and conditions apply and say where drivers can find
more details – this will usually be on the other notices in the
parking area.”


“Group 1 Pay and display [except/free for blue badge holders] [x minutes’/hour’s/hours’] free parking [for [business name] customers only] Pay on exit Pay [on foot/at machine] when leaving Parking for [business name] customers only Permit holders only”


The entrance sign does not have any compliant group 1 text when the code of practice requires at least 1 and no more than 3.


The requirements of section 18 for entrance signage have not been met.


The text size must be 60 mm. It does not look like 60 mm.


The requirements of the code of practice for ANPR cameras are

“You may use ANPR camera technology to manage, control and enforce parking in private car parks, as long as you do this in a reasonable, consistent and transparent manner. Your signs at the car park must tell drivers that you are using this technology and what you will use the data captured by ANPR cameras for.”


The signs do not say what the camera data will be used for. Whilst this was not an anpr ticket in this instance the sign shows a camera sign but does not explain what this information is used for.


The witness statement says that the owner is also the managing agent. This calls in to question the accuracy of the document.

There is nothing to say an contract contains the required information from the bpa code of practice

" 7.3 The written authorisation must also set out:

a the definition of the land on which you may operate, so thatthe boundaries of the land can be clearly definedb any conditions or restrictions on parking control andenforcement operations, including any restrictions on hoursof operationc any conditions or restrictions on the types of vehiclesthat may, or may not, be subject to parking control andenforcementd who has the responsibility for putting up and maintaining signse the definition of the services provided by each party to theagreement”"


M1

[Carmin]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

Hi M1,

So basically you want to focus on the signs and on the witness statement?

Do you think we could/should also point out again with more force that although there was no parking permit visible in the photos, it was there but was hidden by the angle of the photos? Because we never said it ( we said i had one and it was visible) and people might just think that I didn't have it in my car and am now trying to pretend I had with my new pictures. They imply that in their answers anyway...

[mystery1]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

We already said that in the appeal.

No harm in adding a line to reinforce it though.



The operator has not dealt with fact there was no contravention as a permit was on display.

M1

[Carmin]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

So I was trying to submit it.... And I have only the possibility to type 2000 characters.
What to do? There are a lot of quotes that can't really be shortened...

[Carmin]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

I just reworked it to delete the quotations. As annoying as this can be they want only 2000 characters and I can't fit everything.

How does that sound?:


"-The operator concedes that I am a tenant with an allocated space as per my lease. "As this is her allocated space and she is a tenant of the site"

-The operator has produce a series of pictures of signs. These do not comply with the BPA code.
I refer here to section 18.3 of the BPA code of practice and can’t quote it here because of the limited number of characters.
Then, referring to appendix B, about Entrance Signs and especially the items of Group 1 and Group 2 that can figure on the Entrance Sign.
The entrance sign does not have any compliant group 1 text when the code of practice requires at least 1 and no more than 3.


The requirements of section 18 for entrance signage have not been met.


The text size must be 60 mm. It does not look like 60 mm.

Now, referring to the requirements of the BPA code of practice for ANPR cameras, in section 21.1:


The signs do not say what the camera data will be used for. Whilst this was not an ANPR ticket in this instance the sign shows a camera sign but does not explain what this information is used for.


-The witness statement says that the owner is also the managing agent. This calls in to question the accuracy of the document.

There is nothing to say a contract contains the required information from the BPA code of practice in section 7.3 of the BPA Code of Practice.

-The operator has not dealt with the fact there was no contravention as a permit was on display and that it was hidden by the angle of the pictures taken by the employee."

Thanks!

[mystery1]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

Email popla. info@popla.co.uk and write in the box online " email sent to info@popla.co.uk xx/xx/xx "

M1

[Carmin]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

Ok I did as you said. All done, now waiting for Popla's answer.

[Carmin]

Re: PCN on MY allocated parking space!!!

Good evening!
I received the answer from Popla, and the appeal was successful!!!
The assessor writes that although I provided several grounds for appeal, she would focus on " whether the operator has transferred liability for the parking charge notice in compliance with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA 2012)". After explanation she states that "As a result, the Notice to Keeper does not comply with the regulations set out in PoFA 2012.".
It seems it was in the wording of numbers of days before the company could try to recover founds, which they said was 28 and should have been 28 plus one day when the notice was served.

Phew!

Thanks a lot for your help, I certainly wouldn't have managed it on my own!