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iainkb &seeking advice about a NTK parking charge letter received

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  • iainkb &seeking advice about a NTK parking charge letter received

    Hello,

    Recently received a NTK letter from UKCPS which came as something of a shock as it is my first ever such notice in over 40 years of driving.

    They want me to pay a £100 parking charge to UKCPS for allegedly parking in a disabled bay without a valid badge displayed. I can have it reduced if pay within 14 days. Also says if that if I was not the driver I should send them details of the drivers name & address & if not paid within 28 days they have the right to recover so much of the charge as remains unpaid.

    The letter included a photo of my number plate only with no indication of where The driver was supposedly parked,i.e does not show any disabled or any other parking bay with the car in it.

    Letter states The driver was parked at site location of Station Road but not the town or city. The photo of number plate has a time stamp on it but letter does not detail any arrival and / or departure time.

    On the day in question The driver had gone into Lincoln but did not park anywhere at any time the driver appears to have taken someone and dropped her off opposite Lincoln rail station on a road called St Mary's Street where there is a taxi rank, which at the time was virtually empty & was stopped for maybe 50 seconds just to allow her to get out of the car - The driver did not get out & engine was running & drove away immediately she shut the door. ( St Mary's street is the street that runs alongside the station - but They did not at any time enter the stations parking area, even to drive through).

    There are obviously parking cameras in the area covering the stations parking area but how can UKCPS possibly try to imply The driver was in a disabled parking slot & what can I do to disprove this ridiculous affair & not pay them?

    Here is a link to a Google map that shows the paved taxi rank area where They stopped briefly - the station & its parking area are to the left of the picture: https://goo.gl/maps/sp2Qs6E6Z2M2


    Thank you for any pointers / advice

    Last edited by Amethyst; 17th March 2019, 19:12:PM. Reason: Anon
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Hi

    If what you say is correct, they haven't got a hope of winning that one.

    DO NOT ID the driver under any circumstances.

    It would be wise to edit your post....the driver parked....., the registered keeper received a NtK....etc.

    Could you post up a pic of the NtK (redact personal info, but leave all dates/times visible.

    I need a good laugh!
    CAVEAT LECTOR

    This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

    You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
    Cohen, Herb


    There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
    gets his brain a-going.
    Phelps, C. C.


    "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
    The last words of John Sedgwick

    Comment


    • #3
      Edit your post, still possible to infer who was driving.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by charitynjw View Post
        Hi

        If what you say is correct, they haven't got a hope of winning that one.

        DO NOT ID the driver under any circumstances.

        It would be wise to edit your post....the driver parked....., the registered keeper received a NtK....etc.

        Could you post up a pic of the NtK (redact personal info, but leave all dates/times visible.

        I need a good laugh!


        Click image for larger version

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        Thanks for the edit & comments so far. Should I now follow the online appeal process to UKCPS or ignore their demand & wait for them to contact me again?

        Comment


        • #5
          Multiple fails re Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4 section 9 (Postal Notice to Keeper)

          No period of time stated.

          Location not precise enough. (I'm not going to list the locations of all the Station Roads in the country!)

          & if they can't ID the driver........they can jog on, I reckon.

          Only deal with them in writing. (Paper trail evidence.)
          Wait until closer to the approprite 'window'.....they need to deliver (or have delivered) the NtK within 14 days....after that you're safe to contact them.

          Simply state that their NtK is defective when compared to PoFA 2012, section 9.
          (Personally I wouldn't spoon-feed them with precise info.)

          Ask that they immediately cease processing your personal data, remove it from their database, & that you trust you will not hear from them any further in connection with this matter, save assurance that the above is complied with.

          NB...did I mention "don't ID the driver?
          Last edited by charitynjw; 19th March 2019, 17:56:PM.
          CAVEAT LECTOR

          This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

          You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
          Cohen, Herb


          There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
          gets his brain a-going.
          Phelps, C. C.


          "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
          The last words of John Sedgwick

          Comment


          • #6
            My thanks to you & will reply to them as per advice given in a week or two.

            These people are a joke & causing undue worry & distress. I suppose they just hope the majority pay up & they get rich!

            I'm still not sure how their camera managed to photo my number plate as I wasn't even on the parking bay area.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by iainkb View Post
              . I suppose they just hope the majority pay up
              They do

              & they get rich!
              Many are!
              Keep us posted.
              CAVEAT LECTOR

              This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

              You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
              Cohen, Herb


              There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
              gets his brain a-going.
              Phelps, C. C.


              "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
              The last words of John Sedgwick

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by charitynjw View Post

                Keep us posted.
                Hello again,

                Updating this - I wrote to UKCPS telling them the letter is not an appeal but a refusal to pay & reasons as stated along lines of info you gave me on 19 March. They never acknowledged letter so I sent it again, this time by signed for delivery. It was delivered & signed for just after Easter break. They still never answered in any way but have sent another reminder + have added another £30 to the charge & give me 14 days to pay up. No specific mention of court or debt collection stated but info. on back of their letter says court action and / or other enforcement action could be taken if I do not pay up by 14 May.
                Should I continue to wait & see what they say or do next?
                I also made an enquiry to a firm of solicitors but to get legal advice they say will take about 2 hours work & cost about £360 & as it is a potential small claims matter I would not be able to claim costs etc. even if win case. Not keen to try & find that amount as pensioner & not wealthy!
                This really is a pain in the proverbials!
                Iain

                Comment


                • #9
                  Just keep quiet until their next letter.

                  Usual advice is to send by first class and get a free certificate of Posting from a Post Office. Signed for frequently don't work.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by ostell View Post
                    Just keep quiet until their next letter.

                    Usual advice is to send by first class and get a free certificate of Posting from a Post Office. Signed for frequently don't work.
                    Hello again,

                    Since the above update I finally received a reply to my letter to UKCPS telling them I was not going to pay ete,etc.,which I attach. I begin to think they are not normal people! As it is my name & address they sent the letter to I cannot believe they are serious!
                    I await to hear from them when they do not receive the payment demanded by 14 May, but in the meantime I am reluctant to respond to their stupid letter as attached - what say you?
                    Thanks again. Click image for larger version

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                    Comment


                    • #11
                      So just wait some more

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by iainkb View Post
                        I begin to think they are not normal people!
                        https://www.whats-on-netflix.com/wp-...ad-Netflix.jpg
                        CAVEAT LECTOR

                        This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

                        You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
                        Cohen, Herb


                        There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
                        gets his brain a-going.
                        Phelps, C. C.


                        "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
                        The last words of John Sedgwick

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Another update re. ukcps:-

                          UKCPS have refrred this matter to a company called DRP Ltd - debt collection.

                          DRP say the charge for my allegedly parking in a disabled bay without a disabled badge being displayed is now £160 & that DRP have been asked to collect this amount & that I should settle online or via cheque in post by 12 June.

                          I noticed on the letter from DRP that a post code for the town & place where this is supposed to have occurred has been supplied which never featured on any of the UKCPS letters despite my writing to them stating that 'Station Road' could have been anywhere in the country & to which they did not reply giving an exact location.

                          I am informed by DRP that if I don't think I am liable for this charge as the person liable for the charge is the person who was the driver when the UKCPS PCN was issued then in certain circumstances liability can be transferred to the registered owner. They say if I am not sure whether I am liable I should phone them & they will look into it., but if I do not phone them they will take it to mean that I agree I am liable for it.

                          DRP go on to state that if I do not settle by 12 June they will recommend that UKCPS take court action against me.

                          DRP also say I can look at information available online at :www.supremecourt.uk/cases/uksc-2015-0116.html which ruling is seen as an important test case for clients like UKCPS who can indeed expect judgement that I can be liable & made to pay this charge.

                          I am still of the opinion that the PCN charge is faulty because, A. it does not evidence the car was in a disabled bay because the photo shows only a number plate close up & no details of the parking bay area in question.

                          B. The photo has a time on it but does not explain if this is an entry time or exit time so no evidence I was actually parked for any particular length of time.

                          C. UKCPS did not give me an exact location and or post code in any of their letters demanding payment - DRP letter is the first time this was mentioned.

                          This is getting really tiresome & the charge exceeds the amount of my weekly state pension, so is potentially a serious money issue Plus I now find I need to attend for cancer immunotherapy treatment making matters all the more stressful.

                          I guess I will need to wait & see if UKCPS go through with issuing a court summons & answer that when it arrives?

                          What a damn blessed nuisance this is after 50 years of driving without ever being fined for any motoring indiscretions.

                          Any further advice will be welcome please.


                          Comment


                          • #14
                            DRP are third party debt collectors & as such cannot enforce this. (See privity of contract )
                            If it were me I'd ignore them.

                            & anyway, as for hiking the sum allegedly owing, unless they are able to ID the driver....they can't demand more than the amount on the NtK.

                            4(5)The maximum sum which may be recovered from the keeper by virtue of the right conferred by this paragraph is the amount specified in the notice to keeper under paragraph 8(2)(c) or (d) or, as the case may be, 9(2)(d) (less any payments towards the unpaid parking charges which are received after the time so specified).
                            https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga...dule/4/enacted
                            Last edited by charitynjw; 6th June 2019, 07:06:AM.
                            CAVEAT LECTOR

                            This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

                            You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
                            Cohen, Herb


                            There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
                            gets his brain a-going.
                            Phelps, C. C.


                            "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
                            The last words of John Sedgwick

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Thank you Charitynjw, guess I will just wait it out & see if UKCPS decide to initiate court action. If they do I am given to understand that I must respond to any court papers or could be held liable by default? Maybe it won't come to that!

                              Comment

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