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looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

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  • looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

    Hi all,

    I'll try to go into a little more detail later, as taking the kids out, but just wondered if anyone has had a similar situation as me. Last year, I advised my mortgage provider (N**M) that I soon would be having trouble meeting our full mortgage repayments.

    long story as to why, but essentially my wife's mum was struck down out of the blue by a very serious brain tumour, and within weeks went from being a normal, healthy person to bedridden, half paralysed, and requiring 24 hour care. We couldn't afford to pay for the care, so my wife took an (agreed) unpaid leave of absence to care for her; we maintained full mortgage payments by topping up the shortfall from our savings, as I was still working full-time.
    The decline, unfortunately, was rapid, and she died within 4 months; my wife was in a terrible depression, and was signed off by her doctor from work with stress and depression. It was so bad I took time off work to look after our children (both under 3), which didn't help the money situation. When my wife returned to work, we decided I should leave mine to look after the children, as we could not afford full-time childcare (my mum-in-law had been our child-carer), and were not eligible for any child / working tax credits.

    So you can see it was a bit of an extraordinary situation. I advised N**M in October last year that November would be the month I could make a full payment (and that was a struggle). Three weeks later, I was still waiting to hear, despite stressing how urgent it was. I wrote again, and this time was sent a letter asking me to complete a financial planner; this I did, explained the background, and made an offer of 50% payments until I started work again, we sold the house of my mum-in-law (we own a third of it, no mortgage) or would consider anything they proposed - payment holidays, extended term etc.

    They finally replied at the end of November, about 3 days before December's payment was due, which I couldn't fully pay of course; they rejected my offer, but didn't give a reason why, or offer anything themselves.

    Since then it has been incredible frustrating; every letter/ offer I send (about 12 so far) is ignored, or the reply doesn't mention any specifics I asked for, and no counter-offer is ever made; I have made payments of 50% and 60% so far, and this month will probably have to be 50% as we had to pay car tax. They just seem to want to ignore me long enough to then go for repossession it seems.

    Has anyone else experienced this? what did you do?
    I have kept a full paper trail of all my dealings with them, all offers, requests etc, and can genuinely offer no more at the moment (I have even negotiated my credit cards into a temporary payment arrangement, which they all agreed to). I assume its best to just keep paying what I can?

    By the end of Feb that will be 3 month of reduced payments without an agreement in place (we'll owe about £1500) , and I am starting to get concerned the next step will be court. Surely any right-thinking judge would see all the efforts I have made (plus the fact we can completely clear the arrears and resume full payments after the sale of my mum-in-laws house) and not agree to any claim?

    as I said, bit frustrated at the moment, as it seems they are just unwilling to listen, or offer any alternative?

    thanks for reading this far (!), and if there are any pointers, words of advice or experience you can share I would appreciate it.

    Ta
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

    I'll come back to this in more detail later but my first reaction is do not overworry since you seem to be managing this situation really well even if NRAM aren't helping. There are loads of things you can do to prevent repossession and this information from Shelter is a good starting point:

    http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_advice/repossession

    Is this an interest only or repayment mortgage because if it's the latter you may be able to switch to interest only and that will reduce your monthly payments substantially.

    Is your house in negative equity or not so if NRAM agreed to capitalize your arrears (i.e. add them to the loan so you don't have any "arrears") the maths would add up. You only owe them £1,500 which is not a lot in the grand scheme of things.

    Are you claiming any/all benefits you're entitled to since you're not in work at the moment. You gave up work voluntarily (for all the right reasons to look after your children) so that may impact on what benefits you can claim but I doubt you'd be excluded from everything including possible payments towards your mortgage interest (MIS) subject to your wife's income and so on. Have a go at seeing what may be due to you using this online benefits calculator from a charity not the DWP official application portal:

    http://www.debtadvicefoundation.org/...FeXKtAodVGIAVA

    Before seeking possession of a property a lender has to try everything possible first to accommodate your situation and they get into big trouble by the court if they don't follow Pre-Action Protocol which is spelt out in this rather dull document, but it should help to make you feel less stressed about the possibility of a sudden court summons dropping on the doormat. There are steps they have to adhere to first:

    http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pro...s/prot_mha.pdf

    So far you've done evrything right by keeping NRAM informed of the situation in writing. If they've not responded to each and every letter this could indicate that they are not unhappy with the way things are going and have nothing frightening to say. I'll be back in a day or so but I have to rush out now.

    On a personal note it's really heartwarming to see a father give up his job to look after his kids and support his wife through this difficult time :grouphug:

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

      Thanks for the quick reply, much appreciated.
      The mortgage is interest only unfortunately, but we are not in negative equity, there's probably about £40k equity or so, so thats certainly an option -I may ask about this.
      Benefits wise, I was eligible for contribution-based JSA but only for 6 months, as my wife works full-time; I am currently wading through the murky waters of the tax credit system...unfortunately we seem to fall in that middle group that are not poor enough to warrant any benefits apparently, yet not well off enough to get by! it is impossible to live off my wife's income for a family of four at the moment.

      I have made sure I am responding to everything they send, some of which is factually incorrect ('we have not heard from you', 'you have not told us why you are in arrears' etc), while continuing to reach a compromise.

      Thanks for the last comment; the only good thing to come out of the last 12 months is seeing my kids more, and my wife and I are closer than ever. There's always some silver lining...!

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

        If you were on PAYE in your last job and left during the tax year (April - April) could you be entitled to any income tax rebate? Ditto your wife for the time she took off unpaid from her job last year? HMRC aren't known for sending out rebate cheques unless prompted

        I've read your other thread and can see that you've been negotiating with creditors over your credit cards and loans etc since 2008, but maybe you could try and negotiate these monthly payments downwards again so that you can make your mortgage a priority.

        http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...-all&highlight=

        I note you say you've made repayment arrangements for these debts through the court, did you actually get a CCJ on any of them? Because if you did you can apply to the court for a redetermination of those payments to something more affordable. The court would accept your mortgage as priority and that would be ahead of the queue for your monthly income. Some DJs reduce payments on unsecured debts to as little as £1 per month.

        Something else has occurred to me, did you have any PPI on any of those credit cards or loans which you could try to reclaim?
        Last edited by PlanB; 15th February 2013, 12:19:PM. Reason: added PPI note :)

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

          Originally posted by PlanB View Post
          If you were on PAYE in your last job and left during the tax year (April - April) could you be entitled to any income tax rebate? Ditto your wife for the time she took off unpaid from her job last year? HMRC aren't known for sending out rebate cheques unless prompted
          They do on occasion send out rebate cheques completely out of the blue, however, it could be years later. I got one last year from 2006/08 without me reclaiming anything.
          Originally posted by PlanB View Post
          I've read your other thread and can see that you've been negotiating with creditors over your credit cards and loans etc since 2008, but maybe you could try and negotiate these monthly payments downwards again so that you can make your mortgage a priority.

          http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...-all&highlight=

          I note you say you've made repayment arrangements for these debts through the court, did you actually get a CCJ on any of them? Because if you did you can apply to the court for a redetermination of those payments to something more affordable. The court would accept your mortgage as priority and that would be ahead of the queue for your monthly income. Some DJs reduce payments on unsecured debts to as little as £1 per month.
          People have been successful doing this even when there is a charge on their house, a well prepared I&E form showing exactly why you can't afford any more, is essential. If you are claiming benefits the court fee could be waived.
          Originally posted by PlanB View Post
          Something else has occurred to me, did you have any PPI on any of those credit cards or loans which you could try to reclaim?
          Unfortunately they are not likely to pay up if you left your job voluntarily (or even if you got sacked!). They should pay up if you are I'll and signed off as such by a doctor as long as the policy covered illness, not sure if this applies here but it's worth a try.
          Last edited by FlamingParrot; 15th February 2013, 14:39:PM. Reason: Fixing sloppy quote :((

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

            I will definitely be due a tax rebate of some sort, but I'll have to wait until the new tax year won't I? (I left work in July last year). If possible I didn't want to rock the boat anymore with the cards; I managed to avoid any CCJ's, but had Tomlin Orders(? from memory) so as long as they are being paid, interest is frozen and no further action taken. The monthly amounts aren't that large (example, one card of about £6k we pay £30 a month on) and for the small amount that could be further squeezed out (if at all) I didn't want to re-awaken any sleeping DCA's...
            PPI I am checking on; I had an old Barclays additions account which I am currently talking to Barclays about, which is promising (they upgraded me without permission essentially), and will look at other options too.
            I'm always looking at things to cut, or options to raise money (sold old kiddies clothes on Ebay etc) and keep a note of it all, so I hope that stands me in good stead if it does go to court.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

              Originally posted by Decanus View Post
              I will definitely be due a tax rebate of some sort, but I'll have to wait until the new tax year won't I? (I left work in July last year). If possible I didn't want to rock the boat anymore with the cards; I managed to avoid any CCJ's, but had Tomlin Orders(? from memory) so as long as they are being paid, interest is frozen and no further action taken. The monthly amounts aren't that large (example, one card of about £6k we pay £30 a month on) and for the small amount that could be further squeezed out (if at all) I didn't want to re-awaken any sleeping DCA's...
              You can do your tax return early, the tax year will have ended in March this year, so you can submit one for the last tax year at any time after that, no need to wait for the January deadline. I know someone who has done that and also got his rebates early.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

                Originally posted by FlamingParrot View Post
                You can do your tax return early, the tax year will have ended in March this year, so you can submit one for the last tax year at any time after that, no need to wait for the January deadline. I know someone who has done that and also got his rebates early.
                Thats good to know, thanks. Having just done a check on the HMRC Calculator, looks like I am owed £900, which would be a godsend; I'll get to work on that right now!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

                  Originally posted by Decanus View Post
                  Having just done a check on the HMRC Calculator, looks like I am owed £900, which would be a godsend; I'll get to work on that right now!
                  Wow that's good to hear :clap2: It could be used to reduce your mortgage arrears substantially and I don't see why you shouldn't hold on to some to treat you and your wife to a belated Valantine's Day supper out if you can find someone to look after the kids.

                  Did you pay PPI premiums on any of those credit cards and loans which may have been missold? There are some experts on here who could help you recover that money too :thumb:

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

                    Originally posted by PlanB View Post
                    Did you pay PPI premiums on any of those credit cards and loans which may have been missold? There are some experts on here who could help you recover that money too :thumb:
                    Probably best to start a separate thread on the reclaims area where PPI specialists Di and Turbo will see it.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

                      Hi all,

                      NRAM back again, essentially telling me that legal action is pretty much certain. I made a formal complaint to them about various things (they have failed to accept/ reject offers from me, sent an agent to my home when I expressly told them in writing not to, and have failed to enter into any dialogue with me) and it came back today as rejected, though with a couple of 'small' apologies for minor things.

                      One thing I have so far avoided, but they keep banging on about, is to contact their Secured Debt Management Team to discuss things; so far I have avoided this, as I like a paper trail of everything discussed and have found that in the past things that were discussed/ mentioned on the phone are suddenly figments of my imagination!

                      Does anyone think it would negatively impact court proceedings if I still didn't ring them? I have always been proactive in correspondance, replying to every letter from NRAM, sending payment offers etc, I never ignore anything. My worry is that they will make a big thing of it.
                      The other reason I am hesitant is that my situation (detailed in the first post) does not fit into any neat box which is usually the only way the phone people can work.
                      On paper, from current finances, I cannot pay more than 60% of my monthly mortgage; yet, I am job hunting and am in the process of selling my mum-in-laws property, which would completely clear arrears and resume full payments. They will probably just work from 'current situation', say I can not pay my mortgage for the future and go for repossession...
                      be interested to see what people think before I decided to ring or not....

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

                        Originally posted by Decanus View Post
                        Hi all,

                        NRAM back again, essentially telling me that legal action is pretty much certain. I made a formal complaint to them about various things (they have failed to accept/ reject offers from me, sent an agent to my home when I expressly told them in writing not to, and have failed to enter into any dialogue with me) and it came back today as rejected, though with a couple of 'small' apologies for minor things.

                        One thing I have so far avoided, but they keep banging on about, is to contact their Secured Debt Management Team to discuss things; so far I have avoided this, as I like a paper trail of everything discussed and have found that in the past things that were discussed/ mentioned on the phone are suddenly figments of my imagination!

                        Does anyone think it would negatively impact court proceedings if I still didn't ring them? I have always been proactive in correspondance, replying to every letter from NRAM, sending payment offers etc, I never ignore anything. My worry is that they will make a big thing of it.
                        The other reason I am hesitant is that my situation (detailed in the first post) does not fit into any neat box which is usually the only way the phone people can work.
                        On paper, from current finances, I cannot pay more than 60% of my monthly mortgage; yet, I am job hunting and am in the process of selling my mum-in-laws property, which would completely clear arrears and resume full payments. They will probably just work from 'current situation', say I can not pay my mortgage for the future and go for repossession...
                        be interested to see what people think before I decided to ring or not....
                        There's no law that says you have the obligation to ring them or you have to agree to discuss things over the phone. It's always best to keep things in writing to build a solid paper trail. These are serious matters and anything agreed/offered/discussed has to be put in writing.

                        The people you would deal with over the phone are not likely to be decision makers or well qualified to advise you, most of them would have been trained to bully and intimidate rather than help. If you are going to reach any agreement with them, it has to be in writing, any court would see the reasoning behind that so DON'T RING THEM!:nono:

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

                          I only see 3 ways forward here
                          1, Pay off the arrears in one got not likely in the OPS present circumstances
                          2,Let them go for repossesion not good
                          3,talk or write to try and reach an agreement acceptable to both sides?
                          Any other ideas?
                          Last edited by wales01man; 28th February 2013, 16:14:PM. Reason: incomplete post uploaded

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

                            Hi I have an account with NRAM and they have been very fair with me. I would call them and ask to speak to the Financial Hardship team and explain what you have on here. Believe it or not they are actually quite nice on the phone. They have to adhere to the FSA guide lines in treating customers in arrears fairly. Don't lose faith

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: looking for mortgage arrears advice please....

                              Write to NRAM today and explain everything as in the first post and include your offer of payments, how long you expect to be only able to pay the amount you have offered and how and when you will be able to bring the account up to date(MIL's house sale) and that you have no other solution to offer them at the current time and send it by recorded delivery so they cannot deny receiving it.

                              Continue making the payments you have offered and keep a record of all payments made. Create a clear and concise ledger showing all payments you have made already(go back 2 years worth of payments) and any you intend to make and on what date. Showing a previously good repayment history and the reduced payments during this crisis may help the judge decide in your favour if the lender tries to repossess without taking into account your current circumstances.

                              Also, make sure that the arrears the lender present to the court are the actual arrears on your mortgage payments and not your arrears plus any fees or charges, lenders have a habit of deceiving the court into believing you are more in arrears than you actually are so be aware and have your ledger ready to contest the amount if you need to.

                              Do not let them intimidate you!

                              Comment

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