court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

[amelia33]

suspended repo on I Group product (had a thread here somewhere on that last year) paying off the arrears but the whole amount of monthly payment plus the additional sum all being allocated to the arrears, while no sum being allocated to the actual monthly payment-
is this wrong
and
if so, under what 'terms' or 'regs' given that i have an unregulated mortgage product??

[IanM]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

Hi Amelia33

This is wrong. If they have a suspended possession order it will tell them how the payments have to be allocated to the repayments and arrears.

You should have a copy of this order from the court showing the same information.

If I Group take you back to court make sure you attend court with a copy of the order and provide a record of all the payments you have made since the order was made and how you believed the payments were being allocated, i.e. normal payment(keeps you up to date) plus additional towards the arrears(arrears will be reduced by this amount).

Explain to the judge how you have made the payments in accordance with the susp-pos. order and ask him to instruct I Group to adhere to the terms of the order as well by allocating the payments as they are set out and stop wasting the courts time.

Make sure you point out to the judge they have provided wrong or false information to the court due to them not acting in accordance with the order and have caused you distress due to their bringing you to court for their inaccurate accounting methods.

You could always be cheeky and ask the judge to remove the order because of their mistakes. Who knows, if I Group know they have provided false info to the court they may not object. You have kept up the payments and followed the order to the letter whereas I Group haven't so anything is possible i suppose.

[amelia33]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

Hi agian, due to losing my job (long story) disability related, I agreed to pay the difference between jsa mortgage interest from dwp. However, I Group have charged me for late payment, and threatened to repossess in 7 days, despite having spoken to them and they agreed there would be no late payment fee, since I cannot be responsible for the payment due dates dwp use?!! needless to say, I Group are treating the non payment of the previous payment in full via DD, which they knew would be different because they had completed the dwp forms for the interest relief payment, and I discussed it with them? - as breach of agreement. (sorry didnt complete that sentence properly before)

they are such hard work and a nightmare, I have received conflicting letters from them. I will be speakng to them agan on the phone but also, now think after reading replies that approaching the court about this would be a more appropriate action.

I have kept up all the payments and the part payments due re dwp.

[amelia33]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

Hi, thanks for this advice. I have looked again and see that the order states 'this order is suspended on payment of current instalments plus xxxx per month off the arrears, first payment xxx (date).

by my reckoning,that means the date for first and subsequent payments has been set by the court, and that amount comes 'off the arrears' by order of the court.

this is not what is happening, the whole amount is reducing the arrears (quickly of course) but he capital is not reducing and the interest on that is therefore being calculated incorrectly, surely? on that amount?

I am not a numbers person so if anyone can explain it to me, I have all the statements and can see the figures being allocated, however, there is also further additional interest accumulating monthly that is MORE than the sum I am reducing the arrears by? - doesnt this mean I can never pay off the arrears, and also, while I actually have any arrears I am being charged fees just for the fact of being in arrears, being added to the capital, then the interest on that whole amount is being added, so in fact my owed amount is getting higher ALL THE TIME. I will die of old age before I can pay this back?

[IanM]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

Hi Amelia.

If I Group take you to court for possession it is imperative that you attend and explain your version to the judge with all paperwork to support your claim that you have complied with the possession order.

If they use the suspended order to obtain an eviction date you need to go down to the court building and tell the clerk you want to make an application to suspend the eviction due to the court being misled by the mortgage company, provide evidence of their allocation of the payments with your application and you will be given a date to attend court to present your evidence.

If you have a court ordered agreement in place and you have made the relevant payments they should not be adding any fees or charges for arrears to your account so point out these additions to the judge and ask why they are able to add these costs when your account is being 'managed'.

If you are really struggling with the payments ask the judge to 'capitalize' (add to the end of the mortgage) the arrears so you can get back on a sound financial footing without the stress of being threatened with repo every week.

Good Luck and let us know what course of action you take and the result achieved, if any.

Thanks

[pepsie]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

Hi, thanks for this advice. I have looked again and see that the order states 'this order is suspended on payment of current instalments plus xxxx per month off the arrears, first payment xxx (date).

by my reckoning,that means the date for first and subsequent payments has been set by the court, and that amount comes 'off the arrears' by order of the court.



this is not what is happening, the whole amount is reducing the arrears (quickly of course) but he capital is not reducing and the interest on that is therefore being calculated incorrectly, surely? on that amount?

I am not a numbers person so if anyone can explain it to me, I have all the statements and can see the figures being allocated, however, there is also further additional interest accumulating monthly that is MORE than the sum I am reducing the arrears by? - doesnt this mean I can never pay off the arrears, and also, while I actually have any arrears I am being charged fees just for the fact of being in arrears, being added to the capital, then the interest on that whole amount is being added, so in fact my owed amount is getting higher ALL THE TIME. I will die of old age before I can pay this back?

That order is clear enough......you were expected to maintain the set payments to your original agreement and a further £xxx to the arrears and the first payment to the ARREARS was due on xxxx. If they have taken your payment to the original debt and the additional payment ordered by the Court and offset them both to the arrears and continued to add interest and default charges then they are wrong to do so.

I would suggest you write in the first instance to the Claimant asking what mount of the capital to the debt they have received to date, then follow that with an SAR to I Group to see exactly what they are playing at? Before you can move forward to making a complaint to them you must gather all the evidence.

WD

[amelia33]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

thanks, to all, I have done the SAR and asked some pertinent questions! it seems I am paying approx £100 per month of Additional Interest on the 'charges' for being in arrears over the lifetime of the product to date.

It seems to me then that unless I can pay the whole of the arrears in one lump sum then this loan will continue to grow and can never be repaid in my lifetime as it gets larger than the amount I am attempting to reduce it by? Also, the actual charges, £40 per month, plus the legal charge of several thousand pounds, plus the buildings insurance of theirs, (now changed that) - are attracting this 'Additional Interest' at 5.75%. Daily rate,(?) as I say, I cant get technical here as I dont actually understand from the statements how they do it.

[amelia33]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

MCOB - just a guideline or HAS TO BE adhered to by lenders? even in a court?

[amelia33]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

hello, just came back to this site after some difficult times -

the reply I keep getting from FOS and FCA is that this is an unregulated agreement, there fore no jurisdiction, effectively, they can do what they like, when they like, and their terms and conditions say this also, we will allocate as we see fit.

where does this leave me and others with these horrendous agreements, the broker who was acting solely for Ocwen (their name at time) went out of business and the lender keeps pointing to them, but equally there is no recourse to them as pre 2004.

I would be eager to know if there is any precendent of any cases that are similar.

Their barrister cited MCOB at that time as being merely guidelines. Judge agreed.

[amelia33]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

extract -

Expenses

'The mortgagor must ay all expenses when the lender asks for them. Expenses will be added to the mortgage debt and will bear interest at the interest rate from the date when they are incurred until the date when they are repaid.'

with expenses being
'all expenses which the lender or any receiver reasonably incurs in connection with this mortgage
examples are
costs incurred in any legal proceedings (whether brought by or against the mortgagor or any other persons relating to this mortgage)
cost incurred in recovering or enforcing any rights or remedies given by these conditions
costs incurred in recovering any money secured by this mortgage
costs incurred in protecting or preserving the lender security
costs incurred in putting right any failure of the mortgage or the co mortgagor if any to keep these conditions
administation costs incurred by the lender in doing any work in connection with this mortgage
the lender may recover its administration costs by charging a fee which the lender reasonably estimates to represent the cost to it of doing the work in question
any costs and expenses due under any loan agreement secured by this mortgage
the lender can recover all expenses from the mortgagor in full this means the lender can recove them on what is known as an imdemnity basis
the mortgagor must pay all expenses when the lender asks for them
expenses will be added to the mortgage debt and will bear interest......

another extract states
'the mortgagor agrees not to ask the court to agree sale of the property under section 92(2) of the law of Property Act 1925'


I understand this is actually not lawful? however, this second point is an aside to my original query, and do not wish to frustrate those who may attempt to offer advice at this time.

[amelia33]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

Hi Amelia.

If I Group take you to court for possession it is imperative that you attend and explain your version to the judge with all paperwork to support your claim that you have complied with the possession order.

If they use the suspended order to obtain an eviction date you need to go down to the court building and tell the clerk you want to make an application to suspend the eviction due to the court being misled by the mortgage company, provide evidence of their allocation of the payments with your application and you will be given a date to attend court to present your evidence.

If you have a court ordered agreement in place and you have made the relevant payments they should not be adding any fees or charges for arrears to your account so point out these additions to the judge and ask why they are able to add these costs when your account is being 'managed'.

If you are really struggling with the payments ask the judge to 'capitalize' (add to the end of the mortgage) the arrears so you can get back on a sound financial footing without the stress of being threatened with repo every week.

Good Luck and let us know what course of action you take and the result achieved, if any.

Thanks

IanM -

Is it possible to return to the court for a variation or a suspension myself?

[amelia33]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

IanM -

Is it possible to return to the court for a variation or a suspension myself?

Hello again -

I have requested a copy of GE charging policy,

they say this is 'sensitive data' and will not supply a copy of the policy,

even an Accountant cannot see how they are allocating the payments or how the interest is applied?

how do i get this information now?????????????????

[amelia33]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

Hi Amelia.

If I Group take you to court for possession it is imperative that you attend and explain your version to the judge with all paperwork to support your claim that you have complied with the possession order.

If they use the suspended order to obtain an eviction date you need to go down to the court building and tell the clerk you want to make an application to suspend the eviction due to the court being misled by the mortgage company, provide evidence of their allocation of the payments with your application and you will be given a date to attend court to present your evidence.

If you have a court ordered agreement in place and you have made the relevant payments they should not be adding any fees or charges for arrears to your account so point out these additions to the judge and ask why they are able to add these costs when your account is being 'managed'.

If you are really struggling with the payments ask the judge to 'capitalize' (add to the end of the mortgage) the arrears so you can get back on a sound financial footing without the stress of being threatened with repo every week.

Good Luck and let us know what course of action you take and the result achieved, if any.

Thanks

but they are doing this, £40 monthly

[IanM]

Re: court order I Group 'allocating' payment differently?

Hello again -

I have requested a copy of GE charging policy,

they say this is 'sensitive data' and will not supply a copy of the policy,

even an Accountant cannot see how they are allocating the payments or how the interest is applied?

how do i get this information now?????????????????

You need to ask them for a full statement of account showing all transactions on your account including fees, charges, and legal fees etc, and, tell them until they can supply you with it you will be disputing the amount of arrears as being wrong on the grounds that they haven't followed the court instructions on the SPO that they are now presenting to gain possession.

Make an application to the court for a suspension of any eviction and make it clear the arrears are wrong due to them not allocating the payments as ordered which has led to your account showing arrears.