This could have a very major effect on repossessions

[righty]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

I'm sure I downloaded it but now can't find the dam thing - Gawd I'm such a pleb when it comes to computers.

I'll ask Carmel to send me a copy which hopefully I won't lose

[scoobydoo]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

Thanks I think Dougal may be interested as he is thinking it may apply to his mortgage - he is sending SAR to see what comes up

[righty]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

Scooby I think you'll find it applies to ALL mortgages as ALL mortgages are securitized............. that's how they sell 'em - mix of prime with sub-prime

[CYNthesys]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

In the cases of Barclays & BOS shared appreciation mortgages, these were sold with the intention of immediate securitisation, yet Barclays & BOS still shown on land registry documentation. Both Barclays & BOS continue to administer these on the 3rd parties behalf.

[righty]

In the cases of Barclays & BOS shared appreciation mortgages, these were sold with the intention of immediate securitisation, yet Barclays & BOS still shown on land registry documentation. Both Barclays & BOS continue to administer these on the 3rd parties behalf.

They all do Abbey etc & that's the rub
------------------------------- merged -------------------------------
Also as the originator sold your mortgage as soon as it was entered into why are they suing for repo when they have not suffered any loss - they were paid in full at the outset - therefore no loss - no grounds for a claim

[Dougal16T]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

Good evening all,

Many thanks for thinking of me Scooby - the news is I sent an SAR to GE Money (yesterday) who were not the original lender, the original lender was the I Group.

Now I know that GE Money acquired the I Group (when I don't know), but we were never told of the sale/transfer of the debt until after it had taken place.

Just to 'muddy' the waters a little - we also had a legal charge placed on the property by Northern Rock due to defaulting on a loan with them - however Northern Rock 'sold' he debt to Asset Recoveries, and Asset are asking us to repay them from the sale of the property - BUT the charge is still in the name of Northern Rock, and once again we were not told of the sale or transfer until after it had taken place, and then we were only told by Asset.

Are you all thinking what I'm thinking....'.unenforceable' springs to mind - does anyone think I'm right or am I completely daft....(answers on a postcard)...

At the moment GE Money hold a Suspended Eviction Warrant (suspended on my application) until June 8th (with liberty to reapply), which of course I shall do, as the DJ indicated that he may be prepared to suspend the warrant indefinitely!

I'll follow this thread VERY closely.

Best wishes to all

Dougal

[righty]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

So what your saying is that Asset Recoveries having a debt secured by deed have failed to register the change of ownership with the LR - oh dear how so very naughty considering it's a legal requirement & failure to do so is a criminal offense - so how about the 'clean hands argument' if they threaten legal proceedings - or how about failure to comply with the law causing the assignment to be poisoned - & last but not least as they are not the registered owners where is their right to litigate

Now most of these arguments can be overcome if they get their act together as the court may accept them registering their interest retrospectively - on the other-hand the court may take the view, & you would argue, that making such an allowance would be highly prejudicial to you in that we are talking about you losing your home & the Judge may be inclined to punish them for their sloppiness by determining their agreement unenforceable

[Dougal16T]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

Good evening all,

Many thanks for this righty!

I thought this was the case, but until I knew for sure.....

Now then, I have been approached by Asset on the 'phone several times, and in fact their Stella Sharpe has even offered me a discount on the amount she says is secured by them.

I have (some time ago) reminded her that the debt is not registered in their name - they have not done anything about that whatsoever - and have allowed their position to remain unchanged. (I think this is very good news for me - do you think so?)

However, just to muddy the waters (I do this often!), I have discovered that my ex-wife had succeeded in getting the charge that Northern Rock had registered in both of our names put against my interest only, by submitting a statement to the Court stating hat she had never signed any agreement with Northern Rock. I have however discovered the original agreement (provided by McKeag and Co - solicitors who acted for us at the time of the mortgage) which she has signed, (and which is confirmed by Northern Rock's own solicitors, Eversheds!) and I have reported the facts to the Police for prosecution of my ex-wife for Obtaining Pecuniary Advantage by Deception. (Theft Act 1968 as amended by Fraud Act 2006).

Police now investigating........watch this space!

Many thanks to everyone for their input and ideas......suspended eviction order still stands on my home due date now 8th June 2009, but application will be made by yours truly to suspend sine die, on or before 8th June!

As always best wishes to all


Dougal

[righty]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

Sorry to rain on your parade but your ex is probably going to claim she wasn't advised to seek independent legal advice BEFORE signing which if proven correct could place the full burden of the debt onto you & which could also negate any criminal intent

[Dougal16T]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

Good morning all

Thanks for the message righty, and whilst I accept what you say, the documents were sent to us by a firm of solicitors and in the letters addressed to us both were the words 'you should seek independent financial advice before signing these documents'.

I am awaiting a copy of the form sent by Northern Rock which asked us both to confirm that we had sought independent legal advice before signing.

What I think is also important is the fact that she had signed the original document for the loan, this is confirmed by Eversheds (Northern Rock Solicitors) in a statement they made to the Court supporting the facts that my ex has admitted in correspondence that (a) she knew abvout the initial drawdown of £1000 on his loan, and (b)also she has stated in the FDR at the Divorce hearing that she 'had the benefit of the monies', due to my application to have the DJ's decision set aside, as my ex-wife had made a false statement - despite later agreeing that she had signed the document.

However she has taken no action to rectify this and so the Police have received my complaint about her actions and will investigate.

I do not see how she can enter any defence to this.

However we shall see....you should know that at the FDR she said she had never signed the mortgage - but later admitted signing it!

This is a 'lady' who was arrested for embezzlement in 1989, arrested for assault twice in 2006..(on me!!)..need I say more?

As ever best wishes to all

Dougal

[righty]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

'you should seek independent financial advice before signing these documents'. I think you'll find that the foregoing & the fact that she may have confirmed she did seek legal advice when in fact you knew she didn't may still allow her to escape her liability in that the courts may well decide that being your wife she signed under duress from you

Also I think it was a tactical mistake to report her to the police at this stage IMHO it would have been better to wait until AFTER the argument with NR was resolved. By reporting her now not only have you put her on guard & probably on the offensive but you may also have given her access to legal aid in which case you may struggle to match her ability to fight you
------------------------------- merged -------------------------------
PS did you seek legal advice before reporting her & if so don't use them again

[Dougal16T]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

Good morning all

I take your point righty, BUT I cannot say whether she took legal advice or not - this was/is a very independent lady.

However, I took the step of reporting her to the Police as there are other matters (unrelated to this thread) which they are looking into concerning her. The question of Legal Aid will not be a problem, as the police will prosecute if the evidence supports the case. (I have spoken to a 'friend' at the CPS.)

Just waiting for NR and their response to the SAR.

I really appreciate your comments, and thanks for the excellent advice.

Regards

As ever best wishes to allDougal

[righty]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

Once again I think your remark that you can't state one way or the other will go in her favour if she denies it

Also it may be worth arguing that rather than just asking if she had taken advice NR should have asked from who she received legal counsel then the answer yes to the question would have been based on some evidence

[Dougal16T]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

Good evening all

Thanks Righty, we're on the right track.....!

Northern Rock (via their solicitors McKeag and Co) sent terms and conditions with the 'Together' mortgage package, which was part secured (£60,000) and part unsecured (£15,000) loan which say 'Regardless of who signs the drawdown document, even if one party does not agree, both parties are liable for the loan'. One signature was required (although both could sign) from either party for a drawdown of the funds.

Now Eversheds state in their affidavit to the Court (in my application to set aside the change of Charging Order) that they are aware that 'Mrs Rutherford knew of the initial drawdown of £1000, as she had signed the agreement.'

I do not see how my ex can get herself 'off of the hook', so to speak and I think that Northern Rock were wrong in allowing her application to have her name removed from the Charging Order.

Any further thoughts are welcome, needless to say!

As ever best wishes to all
Dougal

[righty]

Re: This could have a very major effect on repossessions

"even if one party disagrees both are liable" - Rollocks! No one can enter into a contract for another without that persons informed consent - In other-words I cannot enter into a contract on your behalf ............ period