FPN for littering

[Calamity]

Hi, I was recently issued a FPN for littering. I was about to leave a car park and was smoking before getting into my car. I notice bins but they had no metal plates to extinguish cigarettes. My kids were already in the car and past me something to put into the boot. I dropped my cigarette to extinguish it before putting it in the bin, walked to boot and returned to pick up the butt to put in the bin. Before I could I was stopped by a council officer and issued with a FPN as he said I had walked away from it, despite it being 6 inches from my feet the whole time he was speaking to me. When arguing about walking away from it he changed his mind and said I was getting into my ready to drive away, however as I showed him and he was wearing a mobile CCTV which he kept reminding me, I have a 3 door car and the seat was still forward so I wasn't ready get in and drive away.
I have emailed the council but there response is that the officer witnessed it and there is no right to appeal.
I don't mind going to court to argue my point but I live over 100 miles away and was only visiting the area.
Anything I can do to force the council to view the CCTV to show it was incorrectly issued as the officer is implying my intention to drive/walk away and hadn't actually witnessed it and then rescind the FPN

[des8]

Re: FPN for littering

Hi and welcome to LB.

Although there is no automatic right of appeal to FPNs most councils do allow some form of appeal.
Your representations have been turned down so your only options are to pay the FPN or risk losing at court.
Court penalties (in the event of losing) are much more severe.

[Calamity]

Re: FPN for littering

Thanks des8

The council wrote in their email:

"The two elements of proof required to demonstrate the offence are the act of dropping the material and of leaving it. In every case where these elements have been witnessed by an authorised officer, the presumption will be to prosecute or issue a FPN, no warning will be given"

My argument is. With the "material" at my feet, the officer can't have witnessed me leaving it??? I wasn't going to walk away from it. I was in the process of leaving and going home, walking 100+ miles was out the question and the car seat being as it was I was in no position to drive away also.

[des8]

Re: FPN for littering

Well it's your choice: either pay FPN or risk cost of a 200 mile round journey + stress +(if losing) a fine (up to £2500?) + criminal record.

I agree.... life can be ****

[MIKE770]

Re: FPN for littering

contact your MP keep up the pressure on him! common sense must prevail! even the council ombudsman,an!

[Snoopy1948]

Re: FPN for littering

Hi Calamity ....

I simply have to endorse what others have said here, it's a sad lesson but paying the fine is the best, grief free option. I guess it's easy to consider these enforcement officers as 'jobworths' and acting too aggressively, but the law is the law and, for litter, it's a good one too.

While I do not doubt your sincerity, it's easy for an enforcement officer to doubt your story and I have never seen anyone stub a cigarette out on the floor and continue to pick it up. I just feel that an appeal will be viewed in the same light.

[Calamity]

Re: FPN for littering

Just had a letter from Thanet council
"after reviewing the CCTV, your comments and the statement from the enforcement officer, I am satisfied the the FPN issued to you ought to be withdrawn and the council will not be pursuing payment from you. No further enforcement will be taken against you by the council with respect of this matter"

[des8]

Re: FPN for littering

well done and thanks for letting us know the outcome.
Presumably you went back to the council with a further request they view the CCTV footage