14 year old CCJ

[Guest]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

Hi Celestine flaming parrot and CYNthesys

POSTER. TAKE THERE ADVISE NOT MINE, THEY HAVE MORE EXPERIENCE AND AM NOT CONFIDENT ENOUGH TO ADVISE ANY DIFFERENT.

But to you three, can i ask you to clear up my understandings of these matters, myu experience was up to 2009 and i dont know if any case law has changed it since. I thought.

1. a creditor had 6 years after the default to get a LO, after that its hard to get a LO
2. That once a LO is granted, its always enforceable.
3. That if there was a 6 year period, that the creditor had not reasonably tried to collected the debt, that the debitor could use this as a defence.
.

This is correct.

[buggaluggs]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

Sorry my computer packed up after i posted the link

A judgment can be enforced after six years however the judgment creditor will have to apply to the court for permission under CPR an explain why the enforcement took so long, usually the court is reluctant to grant permission unless the debtor has been in hiding somewhere.

There is no limit on the action under the statute of limitations on judgments, the case law is in the link. section 24 refers to a new action, bankruptcy for instance.
The enforcement of an existing judgment is not an "action" nor is the enforcement which recovers the money due under the order.(charging order etc.)

If this is a consumer credit debt, the interest has to be separate to the judgment sum, and cannot be charged unless , there is mention in the agreement, there is mention in the default notice, a section 130 notice is issued after the judgment and before the interest is applied. Interest cannot be charged for any period before the notice is given.

The interest itself would have to be the subject of a separate claim, although there has been some small claim cases recently where courts have allowed interest to be added to judgment, I believer these are under appeal.

If bankruptcy is action but new action is not allowed how did the ridgeway case get upheld? Or am i reading it wrong?

The original agreement allows for post judgement interest, thats all the info i have, if a default was sent or a section 130 regarding interest was sent then i didnt receieve it within the SAR so does that mean they cant add the interest like they have done?

Im not sure if the info i received in the sar constitutes as enforcement within the 6 years as it is just words on a paper, like someone has made notes. If there were official docs, should i have received them? Bare in mind that it was my ex they were initialy trying to chase.

[Crazy council]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

I have verbally offered them half the original judgememt to settle but suspect they will decline.

I would not do this formaly at the moment, they may use it as you formaly acsepting that payment is due from you, and i presume your defence might be, if required to defend it

1. You was second on the agreement
2. You left the property with your ex still in it.
3. You had no indication that it was not being paid as per he had agreed with you when you left.
4. That it was a surprise to you upon recipt of the claim in 2009.

Untill you understand your legal position, i would not discuss anything with the creditor.

I was not trying to spin you into a panic by what i said but do not just dismiss it. It probebly is sortable, but it is probebly time to deal with it now

[Guest]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

If bankruptcy is action but new action is not allowed how did the ridgeway case get upheld? Or am i reading it wrong?

The original agreement allows for post judgement interest, thats all the info i have, if a default was sent or a section 130 regarding interest was sent then i didnt receieve it within the SAR so does that mean they cant add the interest like they have done?

If there was no section 130 notice issued then they cannot legally claim any interest on the judgment sum. If in doubt contact national debtlind and have a word with one of their advisers, or if you like there is a thread on here somewhere.

Interest on credit agreements is not allowed under the county courts act. There is provision for interest to accrue on judgment debts, the problem for the creditor is its enforcement, as it is not as said allowed to be included in the judgment. The usual method is for the interest to be in a separate pot, however if the creditor wishes to enforce its collection he would have to commence separate proceedings.

But as said if no section 130 notice is issued then no interest can be charged whilst they are in breach of this requirement. If they charged you interest you need to query this with them and ask them when the notice was sent and if the have evidence of it.

[CYNthesys]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

YB = Yorkshire Bank
Over 6 years had passed since I was ordered to pay YB costs, but YB never took any steps within the 6 year period to enforce the costs order

[buggaluggs]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

Reading things again about this ridgeway, it looks like they could petition for bankruptcy whenever they want in the future!!!! As it is not classed as action under s.24

[Crazy council]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

the only payment made after that was for £15 in 2005, I presume by my ex.

For a number of reasons, get full details on that, make sure somebody did make a payment and that £ 15 is not being used as a bridge to step over the 6 year rule.

[buggaluggs]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

For a number of reasons, get full details on that, make sure somebody did make a payment and that £ 15 is not being used as a bridge to step over the 6 year rule.

I dont think that is classed as enforcement in the 6 years and payments to reset a clock dont count in judgement debts apparently.

[Guest]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/14/section/17



Interest payable on judgment debts etc.

After section 130 of the 1974 Act insert—

“Interest

130A

Interest payable on judgment debts etc.

(1)

If the creditor or owner under a regulated agreement wants to be able to recover from the debtor or hirer post-judgment interest in connection with a sum that is required to be paid under a judgment given in relation to the agreement (the ‘judgment sum’), he—

(a)

after the giving of that judgment, shall give the debtor or hirer a notice under this section (the ‘first required notice’); and

(b)

after the giving of the first required notice, shall give the debtor or hirer further notices under this section at intervals of not more than six months.

(2)

The debtor or hirer shall have no liability to pay post-judgment interest in connection with the judgment sum to the extent that the interest is calculated by reference to a period occurring before the day on which he is given the first required notice.

(3)

If the creditor or owner fails to give the debtor or hirer a notice under this section within the period of six months beginning with the day after the day on which such a notice was last given to the debtor or hirer, the debtor or hirer shall have no liability to pay post-judgment interest in connection with the judgment sum to the extent that the interest is calculated by reference to the whole or to a part of the period which—

(a)

begins immediately after the end of that period of six months; and

(b)

ends at the end of the day on which the notice is given to the debtor or hirer.

(4)

The debtor or hirer shall have no liability to pay any sum in connection with the preparation or the giving to him of a notice under this section.

(5)

A notice under this section may be incorporated in a statement or other notice which the creditor or owner gives the debtor or hirer in relation to the agreement by virtue of another provision of this Act.

(6)

Regulations may make provision about the form and content of notices under this section.

(7)

This section does not apply in relation to post-judgment interest which is required to be paid by virtue of any of the following—

(a)

section 4 of the Administration of Justice (Scotland) Act 1972;

(b)

Article 127 of the Judgments Enforcement (Northern Ireland) Order 1981;

(c)

section 74 of the County Courts Act 1984.

(8)

This section does not apply in relation to a non-commercial agreement or to a small agreement.

(9)

In this section ‘post-judgment interest’ means interest to the extent calculated by reference to a period occurring after the giving of the judgment under which the judgment sum is required to be paid.”

[Crazy council]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

I dont think that is classed as enforcement in the 6 years and payments to reset a clock dont count in judgement debts apparently.

I think it is, like i say, i dont know how the case law has changed since 2009, but any responce from the debitor in the 6 years, resets it

[ODC]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

Buggalugs - Please follow the advice of Celestine who is a solicitor and Flaming Parrot. Im sure Crazy Council means well but they are offering information based on what happened to a friend of a friend. Theres is a serious amount of money involved here so you need decent advice such as that offered by Celestine and Flaming Parrot

[ODC]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

I think it is, like i say, i dont know how the case law has changed since 2009, but any responce from the debitor in the 6 years, resets it

Then why are you advising???

[buggaluggs]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/14/section/17

So


Interest payable on judgment debts etc.

After section 130 of the 1974 Act insert—

“Interest

130A

Interest payable on judgment debts etc.

(1)

If the creditor or owner under a regulated agreement wants to be able to recover from the debtor or hirer post-judgment interest in connection with a sum that is required to be paid under a judgment given in relation to the agreement (the ‘judgment sum’), he—

(a)

after the giving of that judgment, shall give the debtor or hirer a notice under this section (the ‘first required notice’); and

(b)

after the giving of the first required notice, shall give the debtor or hirer further notices under this section at intervals of not more than six months.

(2)

The debtor or hirer shall have no liability to pay post-judgment interest in connection with the judgment sum to the extent that the interest is calculated by reference to a period occurring before the day on which he is given the first required notice.

(3)

If the creditor or owner fails to give the debtor or hirer a notice under this section within the period of six months beginning with the day after the day on which such a notice was last given to the debtor or hirer, the debtor or hirer shall have no liability to pay post-judgment interest in connection with the judgment sum to the extent that the interest is calculated by reference to the whole or to a part of the period which—

(a)

begins immediately after the end of that period of six months; and

(b)

ends at the end of the day on which the notice is given to the debtor or hirer.

(4)

The debtor or hirer shall have no liability to pay any sum in connection with the preparation or the giving to him of a notice under this section.

(5)

A notice under this section may be incorporated in a statement or other notice which the creditor or owner gives the debtor or hirer in relation to the agreement by virtue of another provision of this Act.

(6)

Regulations may make provision about the form and content of notices under this section.

(7)

This section does not apply in relation to post-judgment interest which is required to be paid by virtue of any of the following—

(a)

section 4 of the Administration of Justice (Scotland) Act 1972;

(b)

Article 127 of the Judgments Enforcement (Northern Ireland) Order 1981;

(c)

section 74 of the County Courts Act 1984.

(8)

This section does not apply in relation to a non-commercial agreement or to a small agreement.

(9)

In this section ‘post-judgment interest’ means interest to the extent calculated by reference to a period occurring after the giving of the judgment under which the judgment sum is required to be paid.”

so they would have had to get it within 6 months of the judgement?

If they did, proof was not sent in the sar and the dca havent provided proof of their attempt either.

im still confused over the ridgeway case though

[buggaluggs]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

Thanks odc x

It is my understanding that there is no clock to reset as judgements are never statute barred so not covered under that part of the act.
Enforcement is what the creditors can do not payments being made i think.

[buggaluggs]

Re: 14 year old CCJ

Thanks odc x

It is my understanding that there is no clock to reset as judgements are never statute barred so not covered under that part of the act.
Enforcement is what the creditors can do not payments being made i think.