Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

[robinson86]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

I am a retired police officer. The six-month rule applies to most summary offences, including traffic offences, but not the more serious ones, e.g. Causing Death by Dangerous Driving, which fall under a different set of rules.

If the NIPs and summons cannot be traced, you may be asked to swear a Statutory Declaration at the court. However, you need to first ring the Traffic and Process Office of Staffordshire Police and the Court Manager at the relevant court.

sorry didnt realise would explain your very helpful knowledge i am going to get straight on that today and will post back

[robinson86]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

spoke to ticket office they received nips from lease company and employer but have nothing from me explained why i ignored reminder etc but still no choice but to attend court. just found out that the case was passed to the magistrates on 3rd of the 7th

[bluebottle]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

Sounds like someone has cocked-up somewhere.

[robinson86]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

Sounds like someone has cocked-up somewhere.

i really should have sent my response recorded. i know i should search out he cps officer on the morning and offer a plea bargain where i would plead guilty to the speeding in returm for the failurento disclose beong dropped and i should mention my job relies on my licence and being out of work affects kods csa etc i also have debts which i need my job to pay off should i mention this at the hearing? was also considerong asking my manager to write a character reference as he is unable to attend with me is this something worth doing?

have never been in trouble with police before and only ever been in court for custody hearings so really have no idea

[bluebottle]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

i really should have sent my response recorded. i know i should search out he cps officer on the morning and offer a plea bargain where i would plead guilty to the speeding in returm for the failurento disclose beong dropped and i should mention my job relies on my licence and being out of work affects kods csa etc i also have debts which i need my job to pay off should i mention this at the hearing? was also considerong asking my manager to write a character reference as he is unable to attend with me is this something worth doing?

have never been in trouble with police before and only ever been in court for custody hearings so really have no idea

As part of a magistrates hearing, there is a part of the hearing set aside for mitigation. This is where you can put forward anything that would lessen any sentence/penalty the court can hand down. It is also your chance to explain your financial circumstances to the court. This is called antecedents.

In your case, your mitigation would be that you had sent the Notice to Registered Owner back to Staffordshire Police and had reasonable cause to believe the police had received it. You should also plead that the loss of your licence would affect your employment. You should further plead that you have debts of £xxx which is being serviced at the rate of £xx p.m. and CSA payments of £xxx p.m.. You should also have ready an idea of what you can afford to pay, if you are fined. The suggestion of plea bargaining, in your case, may be a blessing in disguise. Also, make sure you go to the hearing dressed smartly. Appearance does count. They key in any court hearing is BE PREPARED. Also, bear in mind that District and Deputy District Judges in the magistrates court are legally-trained and, in my experience, give better justice than Justices of the Peace who are lay persons who, in my experience, give out crazy, mind-boggling judgements, which have Clerks of the Court shaking their heads in disbelief. In cases I have seen, Clerks have turned to JPs and said, loud enough for everyone in the court to hear, "You can't do that" or "You can't say that."

My view is that JPs should be abolished.

[Nikolai]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

When you get to court ask the court usher if you can see the duty solicitor. I'm not sure if motoring offences are covered by the Duty Solicitor Scheme anymore but seem to remember you could get this free advice if you were at risk of being disqualified. No harm in asking. Get there early. The Duty Sol could speak to the Prosecutor for you. It just might be that the Prosecution are out of time, or if not the Duty Sol could negotiate a deal for you with the Prosecutor. You could always go and see a solicitor of your choice, many will give one-off advice at a reduced fee.
Keep calm and don't panic at court - if you present yourself smartly and act reasonably, that will help you. Hope it goes ok.

[robinson86]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

thanks for all the advice given here. summons said court at 10 got there at half 9 and seen at half 3!! organised chaos springs to mind. got 3 points and 150 pound fine but most importantly get to keep my job so thanks again for all the advice it really helped

[Galahad]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

Thanks for updating, always nice to hear a conclusion to threads, outcome not the best, but certainly not the worst either.

[bluebottle]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

Agree with Galahad. £150 fine for the offence mentioned is relatively lenient. I have seen people get fined a lot more. 3 penalty points, as you say, means you keep your job.

[Lucifa42]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

And as the guys over at Pepipoo are fond of saying "now you need to drive like a nun" until some of your points drop off.

[bluebottle]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

And as the guys over at Pepipoo are fond of saying "now you need to drive like a nun" until some of your points drop off.

Actually, if you look at Post #1, proceeding for 56 in a 50 limit is in breach of ACPO guidelines which recommend proceedings should not be considered unless the speed is the speed limit + 10% + 2 mph to allow for any discrepancy in the accuracy of the speedometer. 56 mph is just within the guidelines. The unfortunate thing is that too many chief constables are being pressurised to issue tickets by faceless "consultants" who know nothing about the law or policing.

[milo213]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

Hi all, i'm in very much the same situation. My wife was driving back in March and got caught doing 37 in a 30 zone. Received NIP filled it in with her details and sent it off. Heard nothing until August when we had a letter saying we were being taken to court on the 11th September 2012. Rang the number on the letter (which I now know to be the safety camera unit) spoke to a lady who told me to write a letter explaining I had sent back NIP and can't understand how it wasn't received. Did this and again heard nothing until I got a letter saying I had been found guilty of S172 in my absence and had received a £700 fine and 6 points. Rang the courts and was told this has happened on numerous occasions and they would see what they could do. Rang back on the Friday and was told that I had to attend court and see if the case would be reopened - I attended court last month and the hearing is tomorrow. Magistrate asked me my plea to failure to disclose driver - I pleaded not guilty, then my plea to speeding which I also pleaded not guilty. I am now panicking can anyone give me any advice on what to do tomorrow and what is likely to happen.

[wales01man]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

GET a solicitor might be better courts and speeding fine mitigation dont go together very well

[milo213]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

I really cant afford a solicitor. What do you mean by that? I was told I couldn't get done for both

[bluebottle]

Re: Magistrates court for failing to identify driver

Hi all, i'm in very much the same situation. My wife was driving back in March and got caught doing 37 in a 30 zone. Received NIP filled it in with her details and sent it off. Heard nothing until August when we had a letter saying we were being taken to court on the 11th September 2012. Rang the number on the letter (which I now know to be the safety camera unit) spoke to a lady who told me to write a letter explaining I had sent back NIP and can't understand how it wasn't received. Did this and again heard nothing until I got a letter saying I had been found guilty of S172 in my absence and had received a £700 fine and 6 points. Rang the courts and was told this has happened on numerous occasions and they would see what they could do. Rang back on the Friday and was told that I had to attend court and see if the case would be reopened - I attended court last month and the hearing is tomorrow. Magistrate asked me my plea to failure to disclose driver - I pleaded not guilty, then my plea to speeding which I also pleaded not guilty. I am now panicking can anyone give me any advice on what to do tomorrow and what is likely to happen.

Unfortunately, 37 mph in a 30 mph limit falls outside ACPO Guidelines. The maximum speed in a 30 mph limit before prosecution will normally be considered is 35 mph (30 mph + 3 mph (10%) + 2 mph = 35 mph).

As regards you not being informed of the original court hearing and HMCTS admitting to this, it sounds like the case is being re-heard. If they didn't, you could rightly claim a miscarriage of justice, as guilt was assumed, not proven. In my experience, it is rare for a case such as your own not to be re-heard.

Tomorrow, dress smartly and try your best to remain calm. Was it a District Judge you saw before (sitting on their own) or a Justice of the Peace (laypersons who sit in twos or threes and don't know what they're doing)?