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Complaint about Court

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  • Complaint about Court

    I have spent a lot in court fees going to county court to get access to my dog which was taken from the marital home when my ex left some 3 years ago.
    I know the legal precedent is that a dog is considered a chattel of the home and as such should not be removed without agreement, but she was taken, it is pertinent to point out the dog was a gift to myself from my Daughter from my previous marriage
    I therefore go to court and ask for the return, however the Judge in her infinite wisdom realizes from our submissions that we both love this dog who at this time was 3 years old and asked my ex and me if we were prepared to share her on a 50:50 basis, I agreed to this and after a battering by the judge on claims made by my ex that I had applied incorrectly which the Judge threw out her claim my ex agreed to go through a telephone mediation process.
    The day after the hearing my ex calls me and asks me to drop the mediation and make our own arrangement, I refused but said I was happy to set out what I believe was fair to help speed the mediation process and after giving her this in writing she agreed.
    We had our mediated telephone call and an agreement was drawn up and was registered in the court, however within the next 5 months she broke this agreement on no less than 3 occasions including on one of these telling me a police officer had told her she didn't have to comply as the agreement wasn't worth the paper it was written on.
    I paid yet again and took the matter back to the court and at a directions hearing given my ex said she was not prepared to keep to the agreement the judge said a 2 hour hearing, when this hearing came around I brought witnesses including my Daughter who gave me the dog who had to take time out of work and travel to attend, this time we had a different Judge who decided he wouldn't bother following the directions hearing suggestion of a discussion of ownership instead putting in a court order that I was now to only to have the dog every alternate weekend with the proviso that he hoped in time this would increase.
    My ex refused to be home when my friend who had been agreed at court would collect the dog, she did this on 2 occasions so I then wrote back to the court advising of the breaches of the court order.
    The response from the judge was "Go see a solicitor or Citizens Advice!" - So I then tried seeing many different solicitors and CAB, none understood what the Judge was asking for and none would therefore know how to proceed.
    My question is how do I complain that this judge and the court process overall failed to deliver or enforce justice against my ex who quite clearly had flouted everything ordered by the courts.
    I have written to the judicial review board, they say they do not take action based on the decisions made by Judges.
    It seems the courts have no teeth in dealing with this matter and for some bizarre reason seem to be quite happy that my ex is prepared to ignore their directions and orders which would seem contrary to the basis of having courts and justice.
    Oh yes I have tried going to my MP with this but he too, despite being a former solicitor does not understand what the Judge is expecting but also is unwilling to become involved.
    I would be grateful if someone here could advise on how I resolve the failings of the courts and judge in this matter
    TIA
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Hello

    Decisions of judges are reviewed by way of appeal. If you didnt like the decision you should have made an application to the judge orally at the end of the hearing for permission to appeal and set out your reasons. The judge would either grant or deny permission. If denied you then have a second opportunity to make a formal application for permission to appeal.

    Otherwise you make a further application to the court citing breach of an order of the court and tell the court what you are seeking.

    If the dog is actually owned by you then you can argue full custody of it since you had previously compromised but your ex-wife has become the arrangement on several occasions including a court order.

    Should have stuck to your guns originally and asked for the dog back, it would have probably saved all this hassle.
    If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    LEGAL DISCLAIMER
    Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by R0b View Post
      Hello

      Decisions of judges are reviewed by way of appeal. If you didnt like the decision you should have made an application to the judge orally at the end of the hearing for permission to appeal and set out your reasons. The judge would either grant or deny permission. If denied you then have a second opportunity to make a formal application for permission to appeal.

      Otherwise you make a further application to the court citing breach of an order of the court and tell the court what you are seeking.

      If the dog is actually owned by you then you can argue full custody of it since you had previously compromised but your ex-wife has become the arrangement on several occasions including a court order.

      Should have stuck to your guns originally and asked for the dog back, it would have probably saved all this hassle.
      I did telll the judge I was not impressed by his refusal to hear the actual directed case of ownership but he said he has the right to hear the matter as he sees fit, I even asked that as I had needed to bring the matter back to court costs should be compensated by my ex but his response was that I hadn't won my case for ownership which is what was stated therefore he wouldn't order costs in my favour which again I complained about to him on the grounds he had refused to hear the case that was brought from the outset of the hearing!

      All in all a rather poor and shoddy performance by this Judge which is where my complaint stands.

      With hindsight yes I should have stuck to my guns but as this was never an exercise in penalising my ex who I agreed had loved this dog for 3 years as had I it seemed that the way it was dealt with by the first hearing was the fairest, just unfortunately my ex doesn't do anything fairly and feels she is above the law but equally the judge should have seen that at the 2nd full hearing should have been acknowledged and reprimanded at the court instead the judge kept protecting her by refusing me the opportunity to question any of the false points she had raised in her statement. Felt totally biased behaviour by the judge which makes you question what was taking place outside of the court room

      Comment


      • #4
        I understand your frustration about the way the judge had conducted the hearing but at the end of the day, the judge does have a right to conduct the hearing as he or she sees fit unless and until you choose to appeal it.

        If you dont appeal then you are deemed to have accepted the judge's decision and the way he conducted the hearing.

        You were probably right to challenge the judge but if he says tough luck then suck it up do the best you can and then at the end of the hearing ask permission to appeal his decision.

        I should say that all of the above also depends on the contents of your applications to the court, what you were seeking and why as we can only go off what youve described.

        I guess the next steps are, what do you actually want to do now?
        If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
        - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
        LEGAL DISCLAIMER
        Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by R0b View Post
          I understand your frustration about the way the judge had conducted the hearing but at the end of the day, the judge does have a right to conduct the hearing as he or she sees fit unless and until you choose to appeal it.

          If you dont appeal then you are deemed to have accepted the judge's decision and the way he conducted the hearing.

          You were probably right to challenge the judge but if he says tough luck then suck it up do the best you can and then at the end of the hearing ask permission to appeal his decision.

          I should say that all of the above also depends on the contents of your applications to the court, what you were seeking and why as we can only go off what youve described.

          I guess the next steps are, what do you actually want to do now?
          I guess Rob what I am looking for is how I bring to notice the very poor handling of this matter which to all intents and purpose looks very biased.
          There is a legal precedent set regarding Dogs and yet the court throughout has failed to follow this and moreover when a directions hearing states that the case will go forward to a hearing about ownership and I get my Daughter to take time out of work and then travel over 100 miles to attend only to have the Judge refuse to actually follow the directions made by his colleague to my simplistic view feel like a breach in itself as I had prepared and geared up for a hearing about ownership and instead he refuses to hear that case and then when my Ex refuses to comply with the Court order he set, instead choosing to just tell me to go away seems a gross failing of Justice and leaves me feeling that there was something untoward going on behind the scenes which leaves me feeling that there is no such thing as justice and it is all a waste of time and money

          Comment


          • #6
            Whilst I understand your frustration, the correct legal route is to make an appeal if you are not happy with the decision of the judge who is sitting in front of you. Shouting, screaming, moaning about the judge and the justice system is not going to help you here as the courts over the centuries have made it clear that any part of a judges' decision must be appealed to a more senior judge/court.

            If you want something to be done about your ex-partner then you are simply going to have to take her back to court over it, maybe this time ask for the return of the dog which lawfully belongs to you, not her. Or you can continue doing what you are doing now but the reality is that you are high unlikely to get the resolution you need.

            Long and short of it is that your ex-partner is taking the **** and you can either let her carry on doing it, or do something about it albeit at your own expense.
            If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
            - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
            LEGAL DISCLAIMER
            Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by R0b View Post
              Whilst I understand your frustration, the correct legal route is to make an appeal if you are not happy with the decision of the judge who is sitting in front of you. Shouting, screaming, moaning about the judge and the justice system is not going to help you here as the courts over the centuries have made it clear that any part of a judges' decision must be appealed to a more senior judge/court.

              If you want something to be done about your ex-partner then you are simply going to have to take her back to court over it, maybe this time ask for the return of the dog which lawfully belongs to you, not her. Or you can continue doing what you are doing now but the reality is that you are high unlikely to get the resolution you need.

              Long and short of it is that your ex-partner is taking the **** and you can either let her carry on doing it, or do something about it albeit at your own expense.
              Hi Rob
              Perhaps I should explain, I did not shout and scream at the Judge. I said I was disgusted with his view to not hear the case that was directed which was to decide ownership and when he said he would not award costs because I had not won my case for ownership of the dog I said that I was shocked given he had actually refused to hear the case for ownership.
              Moreover what shocks me is when he lays down a court order and she chooses to ignore it, I write back to the to ask that the court take appropriate steps over her refusal to comply with the order and the response back from him is to go to see a solicitor. That to my way of thinking is him telling me he does not want for me to act as litigant in person and thus he wants me paying out yet more money than just the court fees but when I have tried to get a solicitor to act they all tell me that they would merely have done the same as I had done and do not understand why the judge is just throwing it back for me to see a solicitor.
              I guess my question is who would be the next level up of Judge to take the matter up with given this man was a deputy district Judge in the county court?

              Comment


              • #8
                Sometimes, its not what you say but how you say it that can be the difference, and maybe the judge was indicating you should seek legal advice to marshall your arguments correctly?

                I agree with Rob, you need to appeal if you want to challenge the decision, your route to appeal would be to a circuit judge in the county court
                I work for Roach Pittis Solicitors. I give my free time available to helping other on the forum and would be happy to try and assist informally where needed. Any posts I make on LegalBeagles are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as legal advice. Any advice I provide is without liability.

                If you need to contact me please email me on Pt@roachpittis.co.uk .

                I have been involved in leading consumer credit and data protection cases including Harrison v Link Financial Limited (High Court), Grace v Blackhorse (Court of Appeal) and also Kotecha v Phoenix Recoveries (Court of Appeal) along with a number of other reported cases and often blog about all things consumer law orientated.

                You can also follow my blog on consumer credit here.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by pt2537 View Post
                  Sometimes, its not what you say but how you say it that can be the difference, and maybe the judge was indicating you should seek legal advice to marshall your arguments correctly?

                  I agree with Rob, you need to appeal if you want to challenge the decision, your route to appeal would be to a circuit judge in the county court
                  Would I have to find the name of a specific Judge on that circuit and address directly to them or would I just address to the court office for the attention of a circuit judge?
                  Thanks

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Photega View Post

                    Would I have to find the name of a specific Judge on that circuit and address directly to them or would I just address to the court office for the attention of a circuit judge?
                    Thanks
                    no you dont get to choose the judge im afraid, the Courts do that, the CPR tells you the route to appeal etc, so its a case of preparing the appeal, lodging the papers at court and then the Court will refer to the appropriate judge
                    I work for Roach Pittis Solicitors. I give my free time available to helping other on the forum and would be happy to try and assist informally where needed. Any posts I make on LegalBeagles are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as legal advice. Any advice I provide is without liability.

                    If you need to contact me please email me on Pt@roachpittis.co.uk .

                    I have been involved in leading consumer credit and data protection cases including Harrison v Link Financial Limited (High Court), Grace v Blackhorse (Court of Appeal) and also Kotecha v Phoenix Recoveries (Court of Appeal) along with a number of other reported cases and often blog about all things consumer law orientated.

                    You can also follow my blog on consumer credit here.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Adding to PT's comment, that's on the assumption that you are still within the relevant period of time to appeal, which is 21 days after the date of the judgment.

                      If you are out of time on that, it might be prudent to consider commencing a fresh claim for breach of the agreed order and then request that a Circuit Judge hear the claim given the number of times applications have been previously made.
                      If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
                      - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
                      LEGAL DISCLAIMER
                      Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

                      Comment

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