Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

[slainte caragh]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

I am not sure what Vodafone are suggesting about further instructions from the court. I repeat what I've said before in that the ongoing fraud investigation/trial does not prevent Vodafone from removing the default. Their position is made to look even worse if other mobile phone providers are removing the defaults or adverse entries or other assistance.

Lee can't say but as I no longer work in this environment I can. It's ok Lee, mines a coffee, white 1 sugar ta very muchly.

If a case has been sent to the Fraud Squad, a mobile provider can be asked to hold fire on changing anything to do with said accounts until the end of the case. I freely admit I have no idea why but have heard of it before. Wether this is to show the affect this has had on individuals etc I have no clue, mine was not to reason why mine was just to pass the message on without giving too much away.

If this is the case than Lee's hands are well and truly tied. He is not being cloak and dagger to be awkward, this is his job and he has to adhere to strict guidelines and policies... especially where fraud is concerned.

I know that right now he is possibly banging his head against his desk in frustration at not being able to do more! I know I was wherever this situation came up..


As I said Lee, we good

[R0b]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Whether you choose to wait it out or not Abbie is entirely up to you, but bear in mind as Warwick has suggested it could take months especially on cases concerning fraud. I suspect there is a no reporting order or something to that effect since there appears to be absolutely nothing on the news front regarding Operation Rosewood in the news. And of course the longer you wait for the case to conclude the longer you have to put up with your damaged credit file.

I did a little digging into the issue of whether civil proceedings are stayed pending the outcome of criminal proceedings and as I thought, the bar is set very high. The test for this was set out in a case a few years ago and is summarised as:

There must be a real risk of serious prejudice to the criminal proceedings to justify the stay of a civil claim pending criminal proceedings.

The Courts discretion to stay part or all of proceedings must take into account the fact that the Claimant has a right to bring a civil claim, it is up to the Defendant to show why the claim should be stayed.

The court must consider whether any safeguards can be put in place and if so, the the claim should not be stayed. Appropriate safeguards might include having the case heard in private, preventing third parties from obtaining any documents submitted to the court in respect of the claim or preventing the judgment being made public until after the criminal trial has concluded.

Like I said, it is up to you as to whether you want to issue proceedings given your circInstances and the evidence you have in your possession. With all due respect to what Lee has told you I am not sure what Vodafone are suggesting about further instructions from the court. I repeat what I've said before in that the ongoing fraud investigation/trial does not prevent Vodafone from removing the default. Their position is made to look even worse if other mobile phone providers are removing the defaults or adverse entries or other assistance.

[warwick65]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Hi

The problem is it could take a long time before there is a verdict.

I think initially it will go to magistrates court and not until the CPS is ready to proceed will it be allotted to either magistrates or crown ( I suspect Crown) . Then there will be a hearing and if a not guilty plea is entered a date fro trial which could be a while. If a guilty plea is entered then I suspect it will be a month or two with reports being done before sentencing

[AbbieA]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Hi Guys,

Quick update, letter to ICO sent last Thursday and received a generic response stating that they aim to reply within 14 days.

Also received a response from Lee (Vodafone) stating:

'Further to my email dated 22 September, I can confirm that the case relating to Operation Rosewood is currently going through litigation.Once the case has been concluded and we have further instructions from the court, I'll let you know.
Unless I have an update sooner, I'll next check this on 9 October.'

Not sure whether its worth waiting it out at this stage or proceeding with court action?

[AbbieA]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Thanks Rob,

Will send today!

[R0b]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Looks much better Abbie. Just one thing though

There are several inconsistencies in the Vodafone account notes provided. Despite 4 fraud investigations concluding that no fraud was found and siting ‘normal usage on the account, normal calls to UK landlines and mobiles’ the account notes clearly show that this account was referred to Vodafone’s internal fraud team several times due to high usage in Europe and calls overseas.

The highlighted word needs changing to 'citing'

[AbbieA]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

And with regards to Lee, I appreciate that he is just doing his job and he is correct not to disclose any information on here. I do not expect him to resolve this situation, and have not asked him to, as it is an issue for the UK Legal Team to resolve. I have asked Lee to provide an update, if he can, as I have had no correspondence from Vodafone since the letter dated 03/04/17 (posted above). He may be able to do this, or he may be able to put me in contact with someone who can. We will see.

[AbbieA]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Hi Rob,

Thanks again for your advice, I have redrafted the letter to the ICO as follows:

Dear *****

I am formally requesting that you investigate Case Reference Number ******* in accordance with section 42 of the Data Protection Act 1998. I am doing this on the basis that I have further information that warrants the ICO considering circumstances left out from the initial correspondence.

The Issue

I would like the ICO to consider whether or not Vodafone are in breach of Principle 4 of the Data Protection Act 1998. Whilst Vodafone have not admitted directly that the account is a fraudulent one, I feel I have gathered enough evidence to show that the default should not have been applied to my credit score and should have been removed when Vodafone were made aware of the situation in 2015, pending a proper investigation being carried out.

Background
The issue revolves around a fraudulent account set up in my name using my bank details in July 2014. I assert that Vodafone have been negligent in allowing a contract to be opened with insufficient documentation and have incorrectly applied a debt and default notices to my name/credit score. I further assert that the fraud investigation carried out by Vodafone has been insufficient and that they have ignored/overlooked the findings of both the ActionFraud and Natwest fraud investigations.

I am basing this on the following points, all of which can be backed up with evidence:

1. The Police conducted an investigation and determined that this account was set up fraudulently. For this I have a crime reference number that has been supplied to Vodafone.
2. My bank conducted their own investigation verifying that the direct debit mandate contained a fraudulent signature and have informed Vodafone of this.
3. Vodafone have been aware of this type of fraud happening since 2014 (as per the action fraud website) and the facts surrounding this account matches the fraud that took place.
4. Vodafone have been unable to supply any evidence of the contract despite persistent requests.
5. Vodafone have also failed to supply me with proof of default in the form of a default notice, statement of account and notice of assignment despite persistent requests.
6. Vodafone have now admitted that the account is linked to an ongoing fraud investigation, but have only done this in response to an email I sent to the company CEO Nick Jeffery.
7. I've never had a Vodafone account prior to this one being set up. I can prove I already had a contract with another mobile provider.
8. The Vodafone account notes I obtained show that the phone was used in Portugal and Spain but on the said dates I was in the UK.
9. There are several inconsistencies in the Vodafone account notes provided. Despite 4 fraud investigations concluding that no fraud was found and siting ‘normal usage on the account, normal calls to UK landlines and mobiles’ the account notes clearly show that this account was referred to Vodafone’s internal fraud team several times due to high usage in Europe and calls overseas.

Taking all of the above into account, it is my view that it is more likely than not that Vodafone should not have recorded the default and/or removed it upon being made aware of the circumstances surrounding this case. Their letter from the legal team in my opinion indirectly suggests that they are aware of the mobile phone scam and that I am potentially one of those victims, otherwise they would not have referred to the Met Police's investigation.

Evidence Enclosed

I intend to base my claim on the following documents:

Vodafone 689728830 Crystal Account Notes
Vodafone 689728830 Siebel Account Notes
Letter from Vodafone Legal Team dated 03/04/17 Reference: 1-456427175962

Please could you confirm receipt of this email and let me know how long you expect the investigation to take. I look forward to hearing from you.

Sincerely,

Abbie

[slainte caragh]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Could it be that Lee is overworked and underpaid as are the people he needs to contact to get an answer

Lee is just an employee and has to work with what he is given. I can personally vouch that he sorted a problem out for me elsewhere, and I was so happy I asked him to marry me :-)

this too

I know how frustrating it is from both sides, both the customer and the agent. He would love to say "You know what? A wizard did it!" but if he gives the slightest hint on a public forum of what he is doing, he is actually breaching an act of Parliament and could end up with 12 years in prison, losing his job and an unlimited fine.

Please believe me when I say Lee is one of the best at Vodafone (yes I remember you helping me out on and old one Lee, I still owe you a cuppa mate!). If he can't help he will find someone who can and I know it kills him to say this is past me. I have to hand it over... cos I was exactly the same.

[warwick65]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

BTW he declined - he has better taste

[slainte caragh]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

again, he can't say.

I have to be careful how much information I give out, and you know I love ya Wales, but it can take days.. even weeks for an agent to get updates and information, and poor Lee is starting from scratch bless him! If this is part of a police investigation it might take a good week to get authorisation to contact the relevant department, Lee won't mind me saying that Fraud departments are a lot higher than regular agents and sometimes they can ba arsey about who they speak to!

If you were the OP and I was dealing with this, I wouldn't even be able to say on the forum what your first name was as that is account specific information, Lee could not only lose his job but end up in the nick if he does... and no one wants that!

His hands are tied by the DPA love, I mean it!

[warwick65]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Could it be that Lee is overworked and underpaid as are the people he needs to contact to get an answer

Lee is just an employee and has to work with what he is given. I can personally vouch that he sorted a problem out for me elsewhere, and I was so happy I asked him to marry me :-)

[wales01man]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Guys Lee isn't being diliberately cloak and dagger.

He simply cannot tell us anything under Data Protection, Abbie on the other hand can if she so wishes! This includes saying if the complaint is resolved as that is account sensitive information.

Abbie, I have known Lee long enough to know he is beavering away in the background working his lil socks off for you. He might take a while to get back but this is because this might be higher than he is, so he needs to get authority to deal with it and deal with the higher levels, if he can help you he will.

Even though we worked for rivals companies I respect his intergrity and work immensely, Lee is one of the good guys.

Nobody expects him to tell all but why has the OP been kept waiting so long

[slainte caragh]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Guys Lee isn't being diliberately cloak and dagger.

He simply cannot tell us anything under Data Protection, Abbie on the other hand can if she so wishes! This includes saying if the complaint is resolved as that is account sensitive information.

Abbie, I have known Lee long enough to know he is beavering away in the background working his lil socks off for you. He might take a while to get back but this is because this might be higher than he is, so he needs to get authority to deal with it and deal with the higher levels, if he can help you he will.

Even though we worked for rivals companies I respect his intergrity and work immensely, Lee is one of the good guys.

[Vodafone Company Rep]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

The complaint is not resolved.

Lee, I replied to your email on Friday and your email this morning. Still not been given a timescale as to when you will have looked in to this account?

Hi Abbie,

I replied to your last email yesterday.

As soon as I have an update, I'll let you know.

Kind regards,

Lee

Vodafone Social Media