probate

[plasticpen]

Im looking for advice about my legal position relating to my fathers recent death.

The family home which as no mortgage left to pay on it had an equity release taken out on its value which as now become due.I have lived in the house all my adult life looking after both my mother and father until their passing since 1972 contributing to its upkeep and maintenance etc.
Probate is now in force on his assets,house etc,I need money to get a place of my own.I understand I can apply for an interim payment from fathers liquid assets ie bank account,through the executor of his will my sister,I would need advice on the wording etc me being a beneficiary of his will,I chatted to the lawyer dealing with his affairs but she was very dismissive of this.
Having lived here for 43 years does this give me any any legal rights regarding having to leave the property until I have found somewhere to live ie the equity company forcing me to leave etc.
Also I looked after father which was exceedingly difficult with him being frail and suffering with dementia, which as taken a big toll on me with no real help forthcoming from my siblings,apart from arranging some of his medical affairs,but rarely there on a day to day basis to help out does this give me any rights or legal grounding etc.I also suffer from depression which makes me a vulnerable person along with bereavement ,I must add there is a will that i haven’t yet seen.,Iam a beneficiary of the will

Any help much appreciated

[Kati]

Re: probate

I'll tag [MENTION=39710]des8[/MENTION] (hopefully he'll have some advice ) xx

[des8]

Re: probate

What a rotten position to be in.

You imply probate has been granted, so you could get a copy of the will from here "https://www.gov.uk/wills-probate-inh...robate-records" if the executor is proving difficult.

There is no duty for an executor to make an "on account" payment to a beneficiary, but if the funds are available, and matters are progressing smoothly) it shouldn't be too much of a problem for them.

Regarding your living in the house for 43 years, and over that time having contributed to the maintenance of the structure, it may well be that you have beneficial ownership.
@Openlaw15 might be able to advise on this.

[plasticpen]

Re: probate

Thank you it is certainly a terrible position to be in,dealing with his passing and now this is very stressfull
Probate hasn't been granted yet,he passed away on the 6th of march so it is early days.Talking to my sister who is the executor it seems things are going smoothly.
She recently had a 3 hour meeting with the solicitor,who is asking for various documents etc,but she is being very secretive about exactly what was discussed.
How do I go about or what is the best approach for receiving an on account payment.My sister almost refuses such a payment can be made,and the solicitor dealing with it was very dismissive of it.
Am I legally entitled to have a copy of the will?
Beneficial ownership sounds very interesting,many thanks,I will approach open law about it

[Kati]

Re: probate

Beneficial ownership sounds very interesting,many thanks,I will approach open law about it

des tagged him for you ... I'm sure you'll get OL's advice soon xx

[des8]

Re: probate

Until probate has been granted, and all creditor claims against the estate have been received, no prudent executor would consider making an "on account" payment.
Unless you are a residual beneficiary, the executor does not have to provide a copy of the will, but as pointed out once probate has been granted the will is available to anyone.

[Openlaw15]

Re: probate

Im looking for advice about my legal position relating to my fathers recent death.

The family home which as no mortgage left to pay on it had an equity release taken out on its value which as now become due.I have lived in the house all my adult life looking after both my mother and father until their passing since 1972 contributing to its upkeep and maintenance etc.
Probate is now in force on his assets,house etc,I need money to get a place of my own.I understand I can apply for an interim payment from fathers liquid assets ie bank account,through the executor of his will my sister,I would need advice on the wording etc me being a beneficiary of his will,I chatted to the lawyer dealing with his affairs but she was very dismissive of this.
Having lived here for 43 years does this give me any any legal rights regarding having to leave the property until I have found somewhere to live ie the equity company forcing me to leave etc.
Also I looked after father which was exceedingly difficult with him being frail and suffering with dementia, which as taken a big toll on me with no real help forthcoming from my siblings,apart from arranging some of his medical affairs,but rarely there on a day to day basis to help out does this give me any rights or legal grounding etc.I also suffer from depression which makes me a vulnerable person along with bereavement ,I must add there is a will that i haven’t yet seen.,Iam a beneficiary of the will

Any help much appreciated

Thanks Des8. Hello Plasticpen, sorry to hear of your problem which is obviously very stressful for you.

Property (ie family home) issues

There are various equity release schemes, which one affects the family home? How much equity does the company own from the property, for instance is it all? When was the equity release (ER) taken out? Was there an existing mortgage previously, if so what was the mortgage's balance before the equity release policy was taken out? What's the name of the ER's company? Does the company have a land charge on the property's register for the equity release (to secure against the property to apply for a sale etc)? The property may have not been registered. The law is since 2003 all properties must be registered. Only a bank with a mortgage linked to the property (ie secure creditor) can apply for a possession order to take immediate possession. Every other company (ie not secure creditor) requires a court order for sale (from a judge). Please provide details so we can ascertain what interest and powers they have over the property.

Proprietary interest: Trust of Land/ implied trust

Beneficial ownership comes into play when some else has the legal ownership. The above wording (in red) is not so important it just means that you do have certain (beneficial) rights. Generally, if it were 43 years of occupancy, including paying to maintain it (the property) it could have provided you with a property interest. So depending how much you have put into it financially you may have (or have) the right to stay there until you can find somewhere to live yourself. You may also be able to claim something as an implied trust has a value (from the proceeds of sale). If you have sufficient interest in the property (proprietary interest), you may be able to get an interim court order to stop any sale. You say the company is forcing you to leave, what steps have been taken so far?

Do you have a copy of the Will for matters relating to accounts, other assets. You may be entitled to 'income' from the your late father's estate. Was there a trust set up etc.

[plasticpen]

Re: probate

thank you for the help.
The equity company is papillio formerly northern rock which was taken out in 2004.
papillio currently have £80,000 tied up in the property which as been valued at £175000 ,the mortgage was paid off at the time the equity was arranged.I don't know if the company as a land charge on the propertys register,how would I find this out.
I did contribute financially but I cannot prove it was more an agreement or an arrangement, if I cant prove this how would the legal system view this?

You may also be able to claim something as an implied trust has a value (from the proceeds of sale). If you have sufficient interest in the property (proprietary interest), you may be able to get an interim court order to stop any sale. You say the company is forcing you to leave, what steps have been

Proprietary interest, a just interest? My sister the executor as implied they are taking steps to force me out but I'm not sure if the equity release company are behind it,she may be bluffing to force the issue.I don't have a copy of the will,as far has I know no trust as been set up.
Many thanks for your help,it as been very helpful and reassuring.
Would it be possible to talk to you on the phone

[Openlaw15]

Re: probate

thank you for the help.
The equity company is papillio formerly northern rock which was taken out in 2004.
papillio currently have £80,000 tied up in the property which as been valued at £175000 ,the mortgage was paid off at the time the equity was arranged.I don't know if the company as a land charge on the propertys register,how would I find this out.
I did contribute financially but I cannot prove it was more an agreement or an arrangement, if I cant prove this how would the legal system view this?

You may also be able to claim something as an implied trust has a value (from the proceeds of sale). If you have sufficient interest in the property (proprietary interest), you may be able to get an interim court order to stop any sale. You say the company is forcing you to leave, what steps have been

Proprietary interest, a just interest? My sister the executor as implied they are taking steps to force me out but I'm not sure if the equity release company are behind it,she may be bluffing to force the issue.I don't have a copy of the will,as far has I know no trust as been set up.
Many thanks for your help,it as been very helpful and reassuring.
Would it be possible to talk to you on the phone

What are the terms of the Will concerning yourself and the property? You could get access to the property's land register online. If Papillio (formerly NR) have £80K investment in a property valued at £175,000 it means the equity is £95K. I need to know your interest in the property, for example how many beneficiaries have a share in the property including you (besides Papillo's interest etc). Your sister is only the personal representative to the home/ assets by law, as a formality. She has to be conducting herself reasonably. Proprietary just means a right to an interest in property (the family home etc). Ask your sister (the executor) for a copy of Papillo's letters threatening taking to court for a sale of the property etc. Tell her you'll contact Papillo yourself if she refuses to provide you with any information. You also inform Papillo that you're an occupant of the property or tell your sister to tell them. As i understand it, the law is that Papillo have a responsibility now as you/ or anyone else who occupies (ie lives at) the property has a legal right to be consulted about any sale.

[plasticpen]

Re: probate

Thank you

The will was read out by my sister,she wouldnt allow me to make a copy.I was left a one fifth share of the houses sale after papillio and other expenses have been taken out,I will endeavour to get a copy of the will
there are 5 beneficiaries me and my 4 siblings.Ithink my sister would be very difficult in allowing me to see any information would it be better to go round her and contact papillio again many thanks

[des8]

Re: probate

[QUOTE=plasticpen;634406
The will was read out by my sister,she wouldn't allow me to make a copy,....I will endeavour to get a copy of the will
[/QUOTE]

Silly sister............ she will need a grant of probate to deal with the estate, and when granted that will becomes a public document and you can get a copy as per post 3.
Why do people have to be so awkward?

[plasticpen]

Re: probate

Iv phoned papillio who tell me they wont discuss the matter until they recieve the death certificate,do they have the right to ask for this?

[des8]

Re: probate

yes.