Intestate beneficiary is deceased.

[HelpfulFriend]

A lady dies intestate, no probate is requested, or granted. 20 years later, a lost bank account surfaces. The bank manages to contact her brother. The father has died 15 years after the lady. Does the brother have any right to apply for the probate of his sister, 20 years after her death? (The father had a will, probate was granted, and his estate was distributed, partly to charity.) Mother predeceased all, no other siblings, no issue of brother or sister, no spouse or civil partner of lady. The son was not a residual beneficiary of the father's estate, but received a specific amount, plus all goods and chattels.

[dslippy]

Sorry, but it is not clear just what relations she had.

[atticus]

Isn't this a fairly complicated situation? Surely what needs to be donne is to identify the beneficiaries of the estate at the time the lady died: this money should be distributed to them, and if any beneficiary has since died, their share passes in accordance with their will/intestacy.

[HelpfulFriend]

Sorry, my apologies if I did not things clear, I will try again.

Lady dies 2000, only survived by father, and one brother.

Lived in rented accommodation, lived with a partner, not married, not legal civil partner. No children. No assets to distribute, therefore no probate applied for.

Father dies 2015, will exists, probate applied for, estate distributed, including some to charity.

From fathers will, brother receives specific bequest in monetary terms, and goods and chattels. Residue to charity.

2022, brother is contacted by building society bereavement team, they have found an open account, in his sister's name.

I realise that as sister died intestate, her father would be sole beneficiary, at time of death.

However, in 2022, as no probate was ever applied for sister in 2000, and as father is now deceased, brother is now only living relative. So, would the brother now be the beneficiary of a 2022 probate for his sister? Or would it still be the deceased father's estate? And would it be a residue of the father's estate?

As the brother received a specified amount of money in the estate, and the charity the residue, does money from a new probate go to the charity, as a residue of the father's estate, or the brother, as the only living relative?

[atticus]

I would say the charity, for the reason that the money should go into the father's estate and be dealt with as per his will.

Will the Building Society pay the brother, if he signs an indemnity?

[HelpfulFriend]

Thank you atticus. The brother has not replied to the building society yet. He asked me for advice first, as he does not have Internet access. I had not thought about any indemnity, I had not heard of that before. I will ask him what he thinks.

[dslippy]

Your question is now clear, and Atti has answered it. When she died, her estate passed in accordance with the rules of intestacy at that time. Later events do not change that.
Assuming, as you do, that that estate passed to the father, then the father's estate is now partially unadministered. And strictly it is for the executor to sort it out. If the specific bequests in his will were satisfied, then the money passes into the residuary estate and the charity now inherits.

How much is involved?

[HelpfulFriend]

Thank you dslippy. You have answered my crucial question. That later events do not change matters. The brother does not know how much is involved yet. It is a very curious situation. We do not understand why the father's solicitor, who we presume was in possesion of the sister's building societies passbooks, did not perform a probate on the sister's assets, and add them to the father's estate. Now we are more informed about the legal position, I will advise the brother to contact the building society, and discover more. (The brother also has an account at the same building society, so he was easy for them to find, but it is strange it has taken them so long.)

[HelpfulFriend]

Further update on this matter. It appears the building society have been in contact with the executors of the father's estate, namely the father's solicitors, and the solictors have refused to engage with them. Which puts the building society in their current difficult position.

[dslippy]

The only people who can get anyuthing out of this are the charity. Tell them what you have told us and move on. Chances are there may only be a small balance in the account - less than the cost of administering.
There is no reason to think the solicitors will have had the (or any) passbook.

[HelpfulFriend]

Thank you dslippy. I have no doubt what you say is correct. As I suspected, the precise administration of probate is tempered by the personal cost and inconvenience of this particular professional executor.