Sold a car on finance by dealer, paid bank transfer to personal a/c, engine light on…

[leed1985]

Hello I am looking for some advice as I have no idea what to do

I will try and summarise this and list all my issues as points

- went to view a car at a dealer forecourt with about 20 vehicles on the premises including an office/refreshment room, asked about the service history and was told it came with “some” service history
- asked about the warranty and was told it was with warranty wise and we could take it into any Halfords if it has an issue
- was told that a service and MOT would be done with no advisories

So I put a deposit down. On the invoice it asks to pay a deposit to a personal account of Joe Bloggs, I thought it was strange this isn’t a company. Asked why it wasn’t a company name and the answer was “because I don’t want to pay tax”. Also card charges. They don’t accept any form of payment other than bank transfer or cash.

The day before pick up they asked me for my bank details to set up the car tax if I was paying monthly. I give them.

Picked up the car a few days later, whilst he was setting up the warranty he said whilst I’m doing this can you pay the balance to the same account. I did. He then printed me a warranty from a different warranty company and if there is anything wrong I send it back to the garage I bought it from, not into any Halfords. A repair limit of £1,000 only too. Which would not cover half of the stuff potentially to go wrong I.e automatic gearbox. I asked for this info before I arrived on the day to collect but was told they will go through it all when I pick up the car. This is how it went down. Papers were given to me after I paid. Too late. I asked for an invoice for the service and was told they do it all in bulk. I again asked for some kind of evidence and he printed me an internal screenshot of the vehicle details (from their sales system I assume) which just listed the car details. In the comments it said MOT done service done and the brake discs and pads done as well as the tyre (all the advisories). He signed this piece of paper. But it is just a print off from their computer, it doesn’t give any garage details on, no price, nothing what was done on the service etc.

I drive away with the car. Engine light comes on. It turns out that the DVLA website says the car is not taxed. I was provided a photo via text which looks like a post office receipt stating the car’s reg and the start date etc. It looks legit, but DVLA still says the car is untaxed 2 days later.

I look into this further and paid £12 for a gold complete car check which comes back that the car is on finance so failed the check. This was at 7pm. I paid for and drove away with the car at 11am on that day, 8 hours earlier. I tried to call the lender but they were closed. At this point I messaged the dealer to say the car is not taxed and the car looks like it’s on finance. I was told it is old info.

Called the lender the next day and they confirmed a marker is on the car, but they can see a payment tender has been put on the car at 10pm the day before (3 hours after I did the car check and messaged the dealer to say it’s on finance, so at the point I bought the car and paid for it/drove off the forecourt it had finance on it)

I then did some digging, found the MOT certificate they did a few days before I picked the car up and it came with a few advisories. I have a piece of paper to say that the advisories were completed (brake pads and discs) but the brake discs are rusty so there’s no way they have been removed.

I checked the oil in the morning so a cold engine 12+ hours after last use. The oil was black. It had a tint of amber but I would have expected it to be pretty much golden/amber like a dark gold ring kinda thing. It was supposed to have been serviced 3 days prior. It was black and only shown a tint of get when shined against the light.

There is also a tyre plug which looks like a repair kit that has been pained over with black tyre shine, I’m sure this would be an advisory on an MOT?

Now digging about the dealer.

- Checked companies house - the company is registered but at a different address and by a different person (director) - the wife of the person whose account I sent the money for the car to.

- a check of the address I bought the car from brings up the name of the person who I paid the money to (wasn’t the person who sold me the car/did the business transaction with me, I think it’s his dad) but everything is very bad. Constant 1* reviews about engine lights coming on, dodgy cars, fraud and scammed a few of the words being used.

- there is a motor company registered at the address I bought the car from, but it is in the name of the person who served me and oversaw the sale (the salesman) who seems to be the son of the person I actually paid. It is not in the name of the advertised garage.

- previous trading names at that address, and one went into liquidation as I seen on a new article and on the insolvency service, as early as only May 2024 only a few months ago. So it seems that this business has changed its name quite a few times. Those previous businesses had terrible reviews

I am taking this car into a main dealer (the make of the car) and they are going to have a look at the brake pads and discs for me and tell me if they have been changed. I am also going to ask them if they think the car has had a service. My intention is to go back to the dealer I bought from and say main dealer just said you haven’t serviced and done the advisories as we agreed pre sale, here’s the video evidence. So please sort it out. I am going to demand a proper garage invoice including VAT and prices and a list of what was done etc for the car. I may need this for future warranties etc if I have to prove it was serviced. I am also going to get them to fix the engine light issue but they have already said bring it back to us regarding that one.

I feel like I just want a refund because there are a lot of red flags. But the deposit and the total balance was paid for by a bank transfer (I did get a personal loan for the vehicle, and paid for the vehicle the day after the personal loan funds went into the account). So they can easily just say no and I have no protection.

Please, help me with my rights here. What can I do to get a refund or am I going to find this very difficult.

I have never been in this situation before, but have leant a lot from it.

[Pezza54]

You stated you were taking the car to a garage for the brake pads, discs and servicing to be checked, but you seem to have forgotten about the engine warning light that came on. Does the owner's manual state if this happens you should stop driving the car or take it immediately to a garage?

The dealer may be right about old info. Both DVLA and finance companies can be slow to update info on websites. Did you receive an email from DVLA confirming the direct debit has been set up? If not, did the the dealer enter your email address on the DVLA website and was the address correct?
You should check again with the fc that outstanding finance has been fully paid. If it hasn't the fc is still the car's owner and the dealer acted illegally when he sold it.

The brakes, discs, fluids, filters etc are maintenance items and you may be able to negotiate a reduction in the price you paid (a partial refund) if it turns out this work wasn't done when the dealer stated it had been carried out

The engine warning light coming on may be more serious. The garage should advise on what is causing it and the potential cost for any repair that may be needed. If the fault is serious you may have grounds to reject the car under CRA

You should have researched the dealer's history before buying the car. Had you done so you probably wouldn't have bought it. The dealer doesn't sound the sort to agree with your request to reject the car without a fight

You can't complain about paying money into a personal account. When the dealer answered "to avoid tax" and you carried on transferring money you were complicit in this tax evasion

[leed1985]

Thanks for your helpful reply.

I have some additional information.

I have researched that the engine management light would flash if the issue is serious, but it does not flash.

I have taken this to a Halfords today and they have documented to me that the break discs and pads have not been changed. Also, one of the tyres is illegal and not safe to drive having been patched up with foam.

They have also said the warning light is to do with the oxygen and emissions or something. They would need to look into it more to find out the exact fault. I have paid a diagnostic charge and asked them to do this. This is because when I take it to the garage to fix I want to make sure they report the fault to me properly and don’t just try clearing it and sending me on my way. Or telling me it’s just a sensor issue which they’ve sorted, if actually it has turned out to be a bigger fault.

Do I have reason to reject? If so, how do I do this and how do I legally enforce this? I suspect they may just go insolvent again and change company name to avoid paying out.

[Pezza54]

Under CRA you have a 30 days from the date of delivery to reject the car if a serious fault appears. This is known as the short term right to reject. Under the short term right to reject the consumer does not have to give the dealer a chance to repair.
It does sound that the warning light may be signifying a serious issue, possibly a faulty catalytic converter or dpf.
Once you have the garage findings about the warning light you should write to the dealer stating your right to reject the car for a full refund under CRA, List out all the faults with the car, starting with the most serious and expensive to repair. You should write that you have paid for a garage report regarding the faults, lack of proper servicing and provide any technical details

[leed1985]

Thanks Pezza.

Question. Because I paid into the individual’s bank account and not a business account, and the terms of conditions of sale were only given to me after I’d paid in full, can I bring a MCOL claim against the individual as well as the business (secondary defendant) as I can prove that the funds were sent personally to him?

I think my chances of a refund would increase hugely if I could bring action against the individual as it’s much harder to just go insolvent again and change the company name (which has happened previously according to google/insolvency service).

[Pezza54]

Please read the article "When does a director assume individual liability?" at www.girlings.com
In particular misleading statements, fraudulent misrepresentation and wrongful trading. If the director is aware, or should be aware, that his company is on the verge of insolvency and takes payments for goods into a personal account to avoid paying company creditors, then the director is guilty of wrongful trading and may become personally liable.

You cannot sue both the company and the director at the same time

Attempting to sue the director personally for breach of the contract by the company is known as "piercing the veil". Many experienced lawyers have tried this and sadly failed

[leed1985]

So I have had a report that they didn’t do the brakes as agreed before purchase, also the tyre has been found to be unsafe a bodge job. The engine light fault will be confirmed tomorrow as it needs further investigation so I’ve had to pay a diagnostics fee. Assuming this was quite serious, would the below complaint letter hold up in court if I completed a MCOL with the accompanying evidence assuming the dealer wouldn’t refund? Can you remove or add whatever you think needs to be removed/added?

I would like to exercise my consumer right to reject vehicle REG REMOVED that I purchased from you for PRICE on 25/11/24, under the Consumer Rights Act 2015. As the below mentioned reasons are serious, I am not obliged to (and will not) accept a repair, especially as I do not have trust in your company and your garage network that the work would be done to an excellent and safe standard.




As reported to you via text message at 16:51, just 6 hours after I paid for and drove away with the vehicle, I had an engine light come on, which was very concerning, and prompted me to do some further checks on the vehicle. On the same day as purchasing, I found out that the vehicle was sold to me with a finance marker on it, see attached evidence stating that there is outstanding finance from LENDER, agreement number NUMBER, agreement dated 21/11/2022. I called the lender and spoke to Luke on the customer service team at 12:48 on 26/11/24, and he confirmed that the vehicle was on finance, though a tendered payment had come in for the vehicle at 10pm the night before (10 hours after I drove the vehicle away from your premise) but the payment had not yet cleared. He advised that he would give me a call on Wednesday 30/11/24 to advise if the payment had cleared and if they were able to remove the marker.




More importantly, I then began to look further into the mis-selling of the vehicle. I say mis selling, for example, because before I put a deposit down you advised me that the car would come with “some” service history, and after payment there was nothing provided and I was told that “it was online” and the best thing to do was to “wait until I get the V5 and then contact DEALER to find out the service history of the vehicle”, this of course misled me to believe you had some service history, and in addition, again before I put a deposit down you advised me that the warranty would be provided by Warranty Wise and the process is, if anything goes wrong I could put the vehicle into any Halfords; however after putting a deposit down and returning to collect the car, as you were setting up the warranty and asked me to pay the rest of the balance in full, and once paid, you then gave me the warranty papers that said it was with Warranty First and that the garage repairer was yourselves, not Halfords. I was also not given the green new keeper V5 supplement, nor was I shown on your computer that you completed the new driver process on the DVLA website, so I have no proof at all that I was even registered as the new keeper. I was also told the pay into a personal bank account of REMOVED because you “don’t like to pay tax” and it would be interesting to tip off the accounts and the registered businesses to investigate this. I note that the person I paid is not registered on companies house for REMOVED, and a search of REMOVED brings up REMOVED and a list of other businesses that have terrible ratings and reviews strikingly similar mentioning engine lights coming on after purchase, tyres, and some branding you a “fraud” and a “scam”. I have also found that the company has been under a different trading name at the same address that has previously, and only recently in May 2024, become insolvent. If REMOVED has been taking payments for goods into a personal account to avoid paying company creditors, then the director is guilty of wrongful trading and may become personally liable. This may then affect his own belongings including his home at ADDRESS, which he purchased on DATE and is subject to a NatWest Mortgage from DATE (I inputted this to show that I know my stuff and have been doing research so none of this is BS) I’m sure you wouldn’t want an unnecessary investigation into NAME’s personal and business dealings should I progress this through MCOL, which is my next step if a refund is not provided within 14 days under the CRA 2015.




It was agreed, as part of the sale agreement that you would provide a 12 month MOT with no advisories. On presenting me an MOT certificate listing 3 advisories, when I questioned this, you signed and annotated my invoice receipt as proof these were done, including giving me an internal print out from your system annotated with comments, confirming that a full service was done, including changing the brake pads, discs and resolving the tyre - the 3 issues from the MOT advisories. I asked for a proper garage invoice with prices etc but this is all you would provide me.




So, after these mis-selling worries, I wanted to be sure that you actually carried out what you said, so on 26/10/24, the day after I bought the car, I booked and paid for a garage inspection and diagnostic fee to either corroborate or disprove that you did what you said. The garage report found that the brake pads and discs have categorically not been changed, but more alarmingly, advised me that the car is not safe to drive because the tyre on the drivers rear side has been bodged together with filler on the side wall, stating that “it is not safe whatsoever”. Incidentally, The inspection also confirmed that the brake discs and pads have not been changed, evidencing that not only have you mis-sold and mis-represented this car to me, but it is not fit for purpose.




In addition, the garage diagnostic report shows that the engine light, which came on within hours and less than 30 miles of driving the car away, has a fault regarding the oxygen and the emissions FAULT, which is a serious fault and the cost of fixing this has been quoted at PRICE.




You mentioned to bring this into you on 28/10, but as you can imagine I have no trust in your company and had you have just cleared the error code or told me it was something less serious and now fixed, I may have never known what was really wrong with the vehicle.




I expect a refund within 14 days as per the CRA.

[leed1985]

In addition to the above letter (if you could advise) can I please have advice on these two points

1) would I have to accept a repair or can I refuse a repair and demand a refund under the above circumstances.

2) the tyre is obviously illegal and unsafe to drive (which was obviously the case when I bought the car) so would I be within my rights to say they can either pay for the tyre and I’ll bring it to the garage, or say to the garage they’ll have to arrange collection at their own cost because I’m not prepared to drive an unsafe and illegal vehicle.

[Pezza54]

If a consumer rejects a used car it is the dealer's responsibility to arrange collection
Why should you worry about the tyre if you are rejecting the car?
Wait for the diagnostic report about the engine warning light before sending the letter
You have a future date in the 2nd para of the letter
Please read and familiarise yourself with the short term right to reject under CRA

If you end up having to make a court claim, your particulars of claim will need to be in short concise paragraphs. You won't be able to send your letter to the court Best to cross that bridge if and when you come to it. You will also need to send the dealer a LBA