Vw response to me contesting excess mileage

[carl12]

Can any one advise what to say in my reply to this letter
thanks

[carl12]

Can someone read this letter and advise please

[R0b]

Standard template letter full of nonsense churned out by VW.

There is a template response to something like this (click here) but you may need to adapt it as it is drafted as a catch all for the usual points finance companies make. So if there's no reference to Section 99(2) or Section 100(4) then you may want to delete those points. You could however, add to the last bullet point because in that case, the issue of whether the excess mileage accrues continually was dealt with by the judge, and she had to say this about it:

The reasons are that I cannot accept the claimant's submission that the excess mileage charge was rolling throughout the contract. It is true on the terms of this agreement that excess mileage became payable at the least as soon as 40,000 miles were exceeded on the claimant's submissions, but only if the defendant terminated the agreement by returning the car. It did not accrue at the point at which any mileage was exceeded, but it only accrued by crystallising on termination of the contract.

The judge went on further to say this:

I am supported in this conclusion by the factual interpretation of the agreement itself and in particular to the natural reading of the first page which has a heading "default charges" and refers first to additional interest for any payment which is late, and at the end includes the term which I have already recited.

Further, I am bound by the authority of Julian Hodge Bank v Malcolm John Hall. Although that case was dealing with penalties for interest on late payments, as well as other charges which applied for sending letters following a breach of the agreement, I consider that it is of assistance to me in reaching my decision.

In any event the definition of total price, in relation to which the defendant refers to section 189 of the Act, means the total sum payable by the debtor under a hire purchase agreement or a conditional sale agreement, including any sum payable on the exercise of an option to purchase, but excluding any sum payable as a penalty or as compensation or damages for a breach of the agreement, and I find that these excess mileage charges do not fall to be included within the definition of total price set out there.

So as much as they might want to say it's drafted by leading counsel, that doesn't mean to say it is legally enforceable. Excess mileage charges would only apply if the vehicle was returned at the end of the hire period and not, when people exercise their VT right.

[Amethyst]

Do you have a copy of your actual agreement ? ( have you checked that this is correct terms wise)

We note that you deny liability for the excess mileage charge under your hire purchase agreement.

You refer to section 100 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (the “Act”) but have failed to note that section 99 (2) explicitly states that “Termination of an agreement under subsection 1 [the right to terminate] does not affect any liability under the agreement which has accrued before the termination”.

You are correct in that excess mileage is a fundamental contractual term. You are asked to predict your mileage prior to entering into the contractual arrangement and the finance is calculated taking into account the depreciation of the vehicle based on the mileage you selected. This is clearly set out in your pre-contractual information, the front page of your agreement and clause 11 of your terms.

Clause 11 is worded as follows:-

11.1 If the Vehicle covers more than:
- the Maximum Annual Mileage in any succeeding period of 12 months starting from the making of this Agreement and/or

- the Maximum Total Mileage;
you will be liable to pay us the Excess Mileage Charge shown on page 1. That liability will accrue with each mile covered by the Vehicle in excess of those Mileages. You must discharge that liability be paying us on demand.

11.2 If you have paid Excess Mileage Charges in relation to the Maximum Annual Mileage we will deduct this amount from any Excess Mileage Charges payable in relation to the Maximum Total Mileage.

11.4 If this Agreement terminates early, we will reduce the Maximum Total Mileage in the proportion which the actual period of hire bears to the period of hire originally agreed. Any Excess Mileage Charge will be recalculated using that reduced Maximum Total Mileage.

Clause 11 is worded to ensure that liability for the excess mileage occurs prior to termination and therefore you remain fully liable for any excess mileage which is over and above that which you had originally selected. Our agreements are drafted by leading Counsel in consumer credit and therefore we are confident that they are not inconsistent with the Act.

[Amethyst]

Merged Duplicate threads so just reposting R0bs post in case it's missed xx

#2.1

R0b commented
Today, 15:16:PM


Standard template letter full of nonsense churned out by VW.

There is a template response to something like this (click here) but you may need to adapt it as it is drafted as a catch all for the usual points finance companies make. So if there's no reference to Section 99(2) or Section 100(4) then you may want to delete those points. You could however, add to the last bullet point because in that case, the issue of whether the excess mileage accrues continually was dealt with by the judge, and she had to say this about it:

The reasons are that I cannot accept the claimant's submission that the excess mileage charge was rolling throughout the contract. It is true on the terms of this agreement that excess mileage became payable at the least as soon as 40,000 miles were exceeded on the claimant's submissions, but only if the defendant terminated the agreement by returning the car. It did not accrue at the point at which any mileage was exceeded, but it only accrued by crystallising on termination of the contract.

The judge went on further to say this:

I am supported in this conclusion by the factual interpretation of the agreement itself and in particular to the natural reading of the first page which has a heading "default charges" and refers first to additional interest for any payment which is late, and at the end includes the term which I have already recited.

Further, I am bound by the authority of Julian Hodge Bank v Malcolm John Hall. Although that case was dealing with penalties for interest on late payments, as well as other charges which applied for sending letters following a breach of the agreement, I consider that it is of assistance to me in reaching my decision.

In any event the definition of total price, in relation to which the defendant refers to section 189 of the Act, means the total sum payable by the debtor under a hire purchase agreement or a conditional sale agreement, including any sum payable on the exercise of an option to purchase, but excluding any sum payable as a penalty or as compensation or damages for a breach of the agreement, and I find that these excess mileage charges do not fall to be included within the definition of total price set out there.

So as much as they might want to say it's drafted by leading counsel, that doesn't mean to say it is legally enforceable. Excess mileage charges would only apply if the vehicle was returned at the end of the hire period and not, when people exercise their VT right.

[carl12]

Thanks for the reply .my agreement is worded as they state . Is this a problem

[carl12]

I have used these templates and replied to vw and they have now sent me 2 letters attached , what is the best way forward now.

[R0b]

Hi Carl,

I think the next step will be to make a formal complaint to the Financial Ombudsman. That should halt the debt collection letters from Themis for the time being.

Take a look at the thread below, particularly posts #8 and #9 which provide an example complaint letter to the FOS and the evidence you intend to rely on.

https://legalbeagles.info/forums/for...ination-issues

[carl12]

Thanks rob

[Jenson M]

Hi Carl,

I am at the same letter stage as you from VW Finance, do you have any more updates or reply letters? Thanks