• Welcome to the LegalBeagles Consumer and Legal Forum.
    Please Register to get the most out of the forum. Registration is free and only needs a username and email address.
    REGISTER
    Please do not post your full name, reference numbers or any identifiable details on the forum.

I've been threatened with legal action for a non-disclosed penalty payment!

Collapse
Loading...
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • I've been threatened with legal action for a non-disclosed penalty payment!

    Hello,

    Apologies for the length of this but I could really do with some advice.

    ​I am in a situation and need to know where I stand from a legal perspective. I run my own business and in May I paid a non-refundable deposit for a service provided by Andrew. The service was due to start later this year. Following this, Andrew offered me a place on an excursion for £1500. This price was discussed via email/messaging. The invoice link was sent to me from his bank confirming the price, and this was paid.

    Andrew sent me a contract for the product purchase late on a Sunday evening in June which was the night before the excursion, and a few weeks after the deposit had been paid. This was obviously after flights, hotels, and other costs had been paid based on the original excursion price, and didn't give me sufficient time to read the contract before departing.

    I then went on the excursion but afterwards decided not to proceed with the full purchase of Andrewís service. I confirmed this in writing with Andrew and accepted that the deposit would not be refunded. Andrew responded saying that due to my not completing the purchase, I would have to pay the full price for the excursion which was considerably higher (about £3000). This additional premium had not been mentioned at all prior to this moment. I confirmed with Andrew that at no point he had mentioned the full price. He responded saying that this was detailed in the (unsigned) contract and also on the invoice link. I checked the invoice link and the description on the invoice had been amended to include a section detailing the additional premium owed should the full product purchase not be completed. I have an invoice screenshot I took the day before which didnít have any of this additional information, so it appears they have changed it after payment was agreed and completed in order to make me pay the additional. I have spoken to the bank in question and although the agent could not see the exact amendment, they confirmed that something wasnít right and I was urged to send the details to their fraud investigation team.

    I just want this whole thing to go away. I donít want to be involved in any fraud investigation (Andrew will almost certainly face huge difficulties if his account is suspended pending investigations) but I am extremely disappointed by the whole situation and it is causing massive amounts of stress. I do not believe I am liable to pay any more than what was agreed, I have not signed any contracts, and I am very unhappy that the terms of the invoice have been amended (to suit their story) which I assume must be illegal/fraudulent. I've not been involved in this industry for long and I feel Andrew is essentially bullying me as he knows I am inexperienced, particularly in this situation.

    Andrew has apparently obtained legal advice and has threatened to take me to court if the balance isn't paid. I can't see how he can enforce the additional undisclosed payment when no contract had been signed or even verbally agreed, and the amended invoice just feels wrong.

    I have contacted citizens advice and they have advised me to send him a letter based on misrepresentation/ false statement of fact prior to any further action from Andrew. As mentioned, I have no experience here and just want it to end!

    My main concern is whether the contract is enforceable? The only T&C's agreed/disclosed is the non refundable deposit which is fair enough. There was no hint of any further penalties or payments of any kind should I not proceed to purchase.

    Thank you

    ​​​
    Tags: None

  • islandgirl
    replied
    Have you told the Police you believe this is harassment? They will know who made the allegation and if it is the same person....

    Leave a comment:


  • JamesT
    replied
    Thanks again for the help and advice. I didn't think I would be back here with more to say but..

    I believe this person has now made a false allegation against me regarding being drunk and acting aggressively towards my children. This has involved police visits and phonecalls from children's services. My children (all under 7) must now be interviewed by children's services.

    The allegations are obviously and absolutely not true in any way shape or form, but I believe they have managed to see some social media posts from the weekend when I had a beer with a neighbour while our kids played, and concocted a story knowing that "drunk" and "aggressive" are trigger words that will elicit a formal response.

    It sounds crazy but there is no one else it could be, no one else disgusting enough to lower themselves to this level, and no one else that could provide the police with all the names involved.

    I'm at breaking point with this crap.

    Leave a comment:


  • atticus
    replied
    Hmmm....

    Tell them to get lost.

    Leave a comment:


  • R0b
    replied
    Hi

    Sorry I haven't seen your posts, I struggle to see what's new on the forum. Well, there you have it, sometimes standing your ground does pay off and I think anyone who tries to state "UK" law is already off to a bad start because there is no such thing as UK law. As you know, the UK is made up of England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. England and Wales are one legal jurisdiction, with Scotland and Northern Ireland of their own, although some laws that are passed apply across all three jurisdictions.

    If they were that confident of winning then I see no reason for them to suddenly drop the claim. You would only do that if you have a belief that you are unlikely to be successful or there are holes in your story that just don't stack up.

    As to their suggestion that they are going to continue with formal demand letters for the debt, I wouldn't stand for that. In fact I would be minded to tell them that you do not accept the alleged debt, it is denied that you owe any amount to them at all and if they feel aggrieved by that then they should be continuing the pursuit of this claim. The fact they are now discontinuing the claim says it all and that their case is hopeless. I would put them on notice that your position is clear and remains unchanged so if they instead choose to send you demand letters for an alleged debt that they have wilfully chosen to discontinue legal proceedings, you reserve the right to bring an action yourself against them for harassment.

    They do not have the right to continue demanding letters when you have made it plainly clear you have no intention of agreeing to pay them any money and repeated demands ignoring what you have said, can give grounds for harassment and compensation (if you so choose to do this). The other added point is that if they discontinue the claim, they cannot then re-litigate the same claim without permission of the court, especially if you pursue a claim for harassment.

    Leave a comment:


  • JamesT
    replied
    I'm sure anyone reading this is bored by now but just in case anyone was invested in this, there was an interesting development this week!

    I received an email directly from him:

    Further to the mediation meeting, we are sorry that we could not come to some resolution before the case proceeds to the next stage of legal action.

    It is with this mind that we are reaching out to you to confirm that we have decided to no longer pursue with Legal action.

    Instead of continuing with formal legal action we will continue to hold you to a high standard - as we do with all clients, with continued formal payment reminders until the debt is paid and trust that you will act in integrity to honour the monies owed for the service you recieved, as detailed in the contract that you did not sign.


    Now this has obviously come as a huge shock and even bigger relief. For now it looks like this is over, but I'd like to thank everyone that offered advice and support, particularly R0b and the time you spent replying and writing the letters.

    Leave a comment:


  • JamesT
    replied
    So it's going to court. I'm hoping a judge will throw it out once he's had a look at the details but wont know for 6-9 months.

    They tried to tell the mediator that "UK contract law" says I entered in to the contract by going on the retreat. I hate to repeat myself too much but I (and others who have been in similar circumstances and are much more versed in contracts than I am) cannot see how I entered in to a contract (or any terms and conditions) that was sent outside of normal working hours and 12 hours before the flight, and that had not been disclosed or even referenced prior to this. The fact that they amended the original invoice to include T's & C's after I had decided not to proceed with services surely indicates they realised their mistake and tried to cover their tracks. They also told the mediator that the fulls costs were on the website which I supposedly saw, yet I've got text messages where I ask what the price is "because the price isn't on the website" and they reply with the price they offered me.

    It's extremely frustrating that it's got to this point and it's been a horrible, stressful few months but I'm not going to be bullied in to handing over money. Even if I do lose, I know I've done the right thing in standing up for myself and my family.

    Leave a comment:


  • JamesT
    replied
    Originally posted by R0b View Post
    Have you called the court, that would be the first step to verify what it means. I have not seen that language used before but based on what it says, it sounds like the claimant may have discontinued or decided not to proceed.

    Originally posted by atticus View Post
    What is the present status of the case? You previously said that it was shown as "this claim has ended".
    Today I received an email from HMCTS who have said that the status was an "error" and it shouldnt have stated that the claim had ended. This has obviously annoyed me somewhat as the obvious interpretation was that they had indeed ended the claim and I was able to move on from this, but instead the stress and anxiety has since returned. I appreciate that the whole service is underfunded and understaffed but someone had to manually change the status so it's incredibly frustrating that such a simple mistake was made but this has had repercussions on my mental health.

    Leave a comment:


  • islandgirl
    replied
    Originally posted by JamesT View Post

    My mediation call is today. I am simply not negotiating any form of payment, but will agree to sign an NDA about this "experience" and not pursue any form of counter claim or complaint to trading standards.
    I have been following this saga and just wanted to say Good Luck today - come back and let us know what happens please

    Leave a comment:


  • JamesT
    replied
    Originally posted by atticus View Post
    Mediation is negotiation, assisted/facilitated by a neutral third party. The mediator does not judge, although he or she may indicate reasons to consider adjusting a position.

    But if you are not willing to compromise, but prefer to go to court - where you may lose and get a worse outcome - then mediation is not for you.
    I'm yet to find anyone that can give a good reason for the contract to be in any way enforceable. He even admitted in his own summary that when the contract was brought up on the retreat, he agreed to discuss it further after the conclusion of the retreat so that I could fully enjoy it. At this point I had obviously not signed or even opened the contract which he was fully aware of.

    My mediation call is today. I am simply not negotiating any form of payment, but will agree to sign an NDA about this "experience" and not pursue any form of counter claim or complaint to trading standards.

    Leave a comment:


  • atticus
    replied
    Mediation is negotiation, assisted/facilitated by a neutral third party. The mediator does not judge, although he or she may indicate reasons to consider adjusting a position.

    But if you are not willing to compromise, but prefer to go to court - where you may lose and get a worse outcome - then mediation is not for you.

    Leave a comment:


  • JamesT
    replied
    Originally posted by atticus View Post
    What is the present status of the case? You previously said that it was shown as "this claim has ended".
    It has now changed to "Claimant has rejected your admission of £1500".

    The mediation email says I have to agree to 3 points; the first being "are you willing to negotiate and meet a compromise?"

    My immediate response is no, as I will not be paying them a penny, but I'm wondering if my negotiation could be that I wont share my story or go to trading standards if they agree to drop the claim? I was hoping mediation was more of a pre-court thing where someone will hear both sides and advise on the potential for the claim being approved in court.

    Leave a comment:


  • atticus
    replied
    What is the present status of the case? You previously said that it was shown as "this claim has ended".

    Leave a comment:


  • atticus
    replied
    To me, that would suggest that they are looking to find a way of avoiding the further hassle and expense if they can, and that they are open to a compromise settlement. It tells me nothing about their assessment of their chances of winning.

    Leave a comment:


  • JamesT
    replied
    I thought it was all over.. Silly me! They have agreed to mediation. To me, that would suggest they aren't as confident as they've made out to be or they would skip it a go straight to court. I really don't need this right now

    Leave a comment:

View our Terms and Conditions

LegalBeagles Group uses cookies to enhance your browsing experience and to create a secure and effective website. By using this website, you are consenting to such use.To find out more and learn how to manage cookies please read our Cookie and Privacy Policy.

If you would like to opt in, or out, of receiving news and marketing from LegalBeagles Group Ltd you can amend your settings at any time here.


If you would like to cancel your registration please Contact Us. We will delete your user details on request, however, any previously posted user content will remain on the site with your username removed and 'Guest' inserted.
Working...
X