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Pipex Help!

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  • Pipex Help!

    On 18th July 2003 I signed up to the "Pipex Xtreme Solo Service" after a very unhappy year spent with NTL broadband. I chose Pipex as, at the time, they had a very good reputation for customer services and came highly recommended. As I work in IT, these endorsements did not come lightly and I was happy I have made the right choice.


    However, as time went on, things started to change at Pipex. At first I noticed that my download speeds where not as fast as I had expected them to be and I did get the occasional line dropout, but customer services were always helpful and matters got resolved quickly. However, what I didn't know then was that these glitches where the first signs of things to come.

    The first big problem came in January 2006. We had a catastrophic flood in our home that forced us to move into temporary accommodation whilst work was carried out to repair the damage. I called Pipex to cancel my broadband contract but was told that I would have to pay the rest of my 12 month contract if I were to leave. I was not happy with this situation, but in the end I kept the broadband contract running for 6 months whilst our home was being repaired.


    Unfortunately, BT screwed up and lost our original home number. This meant that I had to take out a new contract with Pipex when we moved back into our home. I did not think this was a big problem at the time, but I quickly came to realise that it was.
    About 6 months after the flood, one week before Christmas 2006, Pipex decided to debit £276.99 from my bank account – No warning, they just decided to take it. However, being one week before Christmas there was virtually no money in my account so the direct debit bounced an I got charged £34 by my bank.


    I was furious, so I contacted Pipex who told me that due to a computer error they had not be taking my direct debits every month, so they just decided to take it all out without any warning one week before Christmas. Furthermore, I had changed my account package to the then new "Pipex Max" 8mb package in November 2006 and, due to problems with the switchover I spoke to the Pipex call centre on 5 separate occasions but not one member of staff informed me that there was a billing problem on my account. I made a formal complaint and contested this action heavily as I felt and still feel) that it broke the Direct Debit Guarantee. I explained that I would pay it back if it were broken into six monthly chunks, effectively doubling my bill for the rest of my contract period.

    Pipex refused this offer and instead demanded payment in one lump sum, even though they admitted it was their error. In the end, after countless emails and phone calls they offered the possibility of paying it over two months, but I stood my ground, despite them being rude and unhelpful throughout the whole process. In the end, I involved my local consumer affairs officer and, as far as I was aware the matter was resolved. Pipex stopped pursuing me for the money.


    In January 2007 I informed Pipex that we were moving house but was told I would have to buy myself out of the 12 month contract I was now in (the one they made me take out after the flood). Again I was not happy, but after much negotiation they told me they would waive the buy out fee if I opened a new Pipex broadband account at my new address, which I duly did.

    Unfortunately, during this time Pipex changed their Terms & Conditions and introduced something called "packet shaping" or "port throttling" this meant that for a lot the things I use the Internet for, as an IT professional, my Internet connection was incredibly slow, and I really mean slow, like dial-up speed slow. Eventually I could take no more and I made another formal complaint.


    My complaint centred around the fact that the service they were providing was no longer fit for purpose and the only reason I was still with Pipex was because of their aggressive policy of locking customers into 12 months contracts, even if they have given continuous custom. To be fair to Pipex, this time they agreed to let me out of my contract and supplied me with my MAC code so I could sign up with a new broadband provider.
    Unfortunately, things are never that easy with Pipex. Sure enough, a week or two later they tried to take just over £175 from my bank account. I complained again and got an apology this time – They had accidentally forgotten to remove the buy out fees from my account. They also agreed to pay my bank charges that resulted from this error, something that they did not agree to in 2006.


    But, it doesn't end there. Just when I thought it was all over, I got an email from the Pipex collections team informing me that I owed them £521. So, even more complaints to their overworked customer care department. However, it turns out that this bill is for an outstanding amount of £276.99 (look familiar? Yep, that's the disputed bill from December 2006) and a further £237.07 worth of cancellation fees. That'll be the cancellation fees I was told I wouldn't have to pay in January – Great.

    The question is, what do I do now? I have informed Pipex that I am not happy with any of this and that I am quite prepared to take the matter to court if need be. I have simply had it with them now, I really have. Can they still pursue me for the original disputed bill of £276.99? Where do I stand?
    When we love, we always strive to become better than we are.

    When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too.

    Paulo Coelho


  • #2
    Are Pipex regulated by the industry? I would think that a stongly worded letter putting down chronologically what has happened, with inconvenience, mismanagement of the account, and appalling customer services. See what response they will give prior to taking it further.

    Comment


    • #3
      You can only realistically take this to court if you pay it first; I would encourage you to follow what Nattie says first, but at all costs stand your ground. Don't do this via email either; start writing letters, refuse to discuss the matter over the 'phone, and stick with the letters from now on.

      I would think that if you don't pay it, at some point they will take YOU to court (fully expecting you not to turn up) and when it gets there they are going to look extremely foolish.

      Tom
      I will not provide support by Private Message under any circumstances. This is for your protection and mine. Any advice I give is my own opinion and carries no legal weight. Check it before you use it!
      Over £1200 claimed in several actions against several organisations.

      Comment


      • #4
        Thanks for the replies.

        Nattie, They are regulated by OFCOM.

        Why not Emails, stone?
        When we love, we always strive to become better than we are.

        When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too.

        Paulo Coelho

        Comment


        • #5
          Because letters are seen as far more formal and far more "real" and businesslike. Companies don't tend to ignore letters (and if they do, courts take a dim view of it). Emails however can be claimed to have been "lost in the ether", or "network problems prevented us receiving it" etc etc etc. Under Civil Procedure Rules, a letter is deemed received two days after sending; that is Law and incontrovertible. Currently an email has no such protection of its status so they can legitimately claim never to have received it.

          Tom
          I will not provide support by Private Message under any circumstances. This is for your protection and mine. Any advice I give is my own opinion and carries no legal weight. Check it before you use it!
          Over £1200 claimed in several actions against several organisations.

          Comment


          • #6
            Ok Well I tried letters they dont respond email is best for now. So everyone ready for an epic....

            On 02/07/07, kayleighxxx > wrote:
            Dear xxxx

            Thank you for your email.

            Please accept my apologies for the delayed response.

            The cancellation fee for £239.07 will be removed from the outstanding balance, therefore leaving £281.98. This balance is made up of the invoices from June 2006 to December 2006 including all talk invoices. This outstanding balance requires payment, as a gesture of goodwill I can arrange a payment plan with my finance team so the balance can be cleared over the next few months.

            All invoices and talk invoice have been sent to you, if you have any queries with the outstanding balance please do not hesitate to contact me.

            I apologise for any inconvenience caused throughout this issue.
            Yours Sincerely
            Kayleigh
            Customer Relations Representative
            Pipex Internet Ltd

            Phone: 0845 077 2455
            Fax: 0870 243 4440
            http://www.pipex.net
            When we love, we always strive to become better than we are.

            When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too.

            Paulo Coelho

            Comment


            • #7
              Sent: 02 July 2007 11:46
              To: kayleigh xxxx
              Subject: RE: Unhappy customer - Please Help



              Hi Kayleigh,



              I appreciate your efforts regarding this matter. in respect to the outstanding balance of £281.98, you should be able to see from your records that you attempted to debit this from my account in December 2006, without warning, in direct breach of the Direct debit Guarantee. This large figure was generated because you had failed to take monthly direct debits from my account from June 2006 - November 2006 as per our direct debit agreement. This was your mistake, not mine.



              Due to the timing of this, the direct debit was not paid and I was charged £34 by my bank for this. As you have already agreed to re-imburse me for the £35 (+ £25) that I have been charged for the incorrect £175 direct debit last month, can you also see fit to re-imburse me for the £34 that I was charged by my bank in 2006? I can, of course, provide you with proof of these charges.



              Taking these into account, the adjusted total amount repayable to you would be £187.98, an amount that, as per your suggestion, I will be happy to repay over a period of 6 months, in installments of £31.33. This repayment timeframe is the same that I put forward to Pipex in December 2006, which, if it had been agreed then, would have menat that this amount would already have been repaid. I think the 6 month timeframe is absolutely fair as it equates to the same monthly timeframe that this amount would have been paid over if you had taken the direct debit payments each month as you were supposed to in the first place as per our Direct debit agreement.



              I trust you agree that this is a fair offer and that we can now move forward to a final settlement agreement and finally put the whole Pipex customer experience behind me.



              I look forward to hearing back from you.



              xxxxx
              When we love, we always strive to become better than we are.

              When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too.

              Paulo Coelho

              Comment


              • #8
                On 04/07/07, kayleigh xxxx> wrote:
                Dear xxx

                Thank you for your reply.

                I have arranged a credit for the cancellation fee therefore the outstanding balance now stands at £281.98. As you have mentioned below please can you send me evidence of the fees charged back in 2006.

                I apologise for any inconvenience caused, if you have any further queries please do not hesitate to contact me.
                Yours Sincerely
                Kayleigh
                When we love, we always strive to become better than we are.

                When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too.

                Paulo Coelho

                Comment


                • #9
                  On 24/07/07, wrote:
                  Hi Kayleigh,

                  Please find attached a zip file containing three scanned pages from my online statements. My bank account does not provide me with paper statements, so this is the best I can do.

                  If I can draw your attention to the December 2006 statement, you can clearly see that you tried to withdraw £276.99 from my account on 13th December 2006, with no warning, in direct breach of the Direct Debit Guarantee, an action for which I was charged £34 - as previously stated.

                  Following on from this I was charged a further £34 on 15th June 2007 when you mistakenly tried to withdraw £175.77 from my account. This action also took my account over the agreed overdraft limit and as you can see, on 6th July 2007 I was charged a further £25 Unauthorised overdraft charge for this action.

                  This is a total of £93.00 worth of bank charges, all of which were a direct result of your errors.

                  I would also like to highlight the fact that the amount you intended to debit from my account in December 2006 was £276.99 - NOT £281.98 as you have most recently stated - a figure wich I believe contains some amount of interest. I am not prepared to pay this inflated figure as this outstanding payment only exists due to your error and, despite myself showing willingness to pay over 6 months, has not been collected for no other reason than your company's further errors and total lack of customer care.

                  Based on these - true - figures I believe the outstanding balance to be as follows:

                  £276.99
                  -£34.00
                  -£34.00
                  -£25.00

                  = £183.99

                  As stated previously, I am more than happy to pay this amount back to you over 6 monthly payments as this is the exact timeframe that this amount should have been collected over in the first place. Again, using these figures, this would work out at 5 monthly payments of £30.66 with a final monthly payment of £30.69.

                  If you agree with these figures and are happy for me to make the payments as agreed, please let me know so that I may have that agreement in writing and inform my bank so that I can commence payments to you in order to resolve this matter once and for all. For the record, I will only pay you via standing order as your company has clearly proven on two separate occasions that it cannot be trusted with Direct Debit payments.

                  Sincerely,
                  xxx
                  When we love, we always strive to become better than we are.

                  When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too.

                  Paulo Coelho

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Sent: 26 July 2007 19:04

                    To: kayleigh
                    Subject: Re: Unhappy customer - Please Help




                    Hi Kayleigh,

                    Further to my last email (below) I received an automated phone call from Pipex informing me that you have attempted to take a Direct Debit payment from my bank and that it has been returned unpaid.

                    May I remind you that, until we have agreed a repayment plan in line with my recommendations below, you are not authorised to take any payment from my bank account as there is no current Direct Debit agreement in place.

                    First of all, I would ask you to ensure that you do not attempt to take any further payments from my account. Once again, I do not authorise you to do so and I will ensure that the Direct Debit agreement is canceled by my bank. As detailed in my last email, I will set up a standing order to pay any outstanding amounts back to you.

                    Secondly, this action has led to a further bank charge of £34 on my account, bringing the final sum I owe you down to £149.99. The message implied that you will make further attempts to illegally remove funds from my account. Each time you attempt to do this my bank will charge me £34, please note that any additional fines that I receive will be removed from the outstanding balance in the same way.

                    Please respond as soon as possible so that we can resolve this matter.

                    Sincerely,
                    xxx
                    When we love, we always strive to become better than we are.

                    When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too.

                    Paulo Coelho

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      On 30/07/07, kayleigh wrote:
                      Dear xxxx

                      Thank you for your email.

                      As this is a finance issues I will need to pass this case on to them, however they will require information to back up your claim for the bank charges incurred. Please could you send me hard copies of your bank statement and also a letter from your bank stating that the charges were caused by Pipex? Once we have this information we can look into the outstanding balance on the account.

                      I apologise for any inconvenience caused, if you have any further queries please do not hesitate to contact me.
                      Yours Sincerely
                      Kayleigh
                      When we love, we always strive to become better than we are.

                      When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too.

                      Paulo Coelho

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Fromxx
                        Sent: 30 July 2007 14:00
                        To: kayleigh
                        Subject: Re: Unhappy customer - Please Help



                        Hi Kayleigh,



                        Thank you for your email. I trust you have ensured that no further attempts have been made to withdraw funds from my bank account until we have agreed on a repayment plan. Any further attempts to do so will result in a refusal to pay from my bank.



                        As explained in my last email, my bank account does not provide me with printed statements as it is an Internet banking only account. These type of accounts are now quite popular due to the environmental implications of a paperless system. Regardless, if I were to send you "hard copies" they would just be print outs of the images you already have. So, you could save a lot of hassle by simply printing out the images you already have at your end.



                        Secondly, you are asking me to provide you proof of the fact that you attempted to take money out of my account. I hope you can see how ridiculous that might appear to me. Pipex tried to take the money out of my account, therefore you must have a record of that. If you don't, well, that's really not my problem. I can't imagine that it would be too taxing to match your records with my bank statements. Of course, if this did prove too difficult, you could always contact my bank directly, you definitely have my bank detials on file, as you keep trying to take money from my account.



                        Once again, this is your error, in fact ALL of this is your fault, all I'm asking you to do is to get it sorted, resolve the bank charges issue (for which I have given you proof), agree a sum and let me pay it so I can finally say goodbye to the massive nightmare that is the reality of being a Pipex customer. Given this, do you think it would be at all possible for you to resolve this matter, as requested, with the documents I have provided you as per your initial request?



                        Furthermore, you have not explained why Pipex are still trying to take money from my account, a simple explanation would go a long way on this one as I really have had just about enough of all of this now -enough is enough.



                        Sincerely,
                        When we love, we always strive to become better than we are.

                        When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too.

                        Paulo Coelho

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          On 01/08/07, kayleigh Bilyard < customercare@pipex.net> wrote: Dear xxxx



                          Thank you for your reply.

                          In your previous email you have advised further charges on your account as a result of Pipex trying to debit money from your account, please could you send me this statement as well as the other via email will be fine so I can take this to my finance department.

                          Pipex have tried to debit this money as it is an outstanding balance on the account, every week sweeps are do to pick the accounts that are outstanding an payments are attempted.

                          Once I have all the information needed I shall get back to your with the outcome, I will also arrange the payment plan with my finance department. The way a payment plan can be arrange is for a third of the balance to be paid as the first payment. This will need to be done via a credit or debit card or alternately via cheque.

                          I apologise for any inconvenience caused, and thank you for your continued patience.
                          Yours Sincerely
                          Kayleigh
                          When we love, we always strive to become better than we are.

                          When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too.

                          Paulo Coelho

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Date: 05-Aug-2007 22:01
                            Subject: Re: Unhappy customer - Please Help
                            To: kayleigh

                            Hi Kayleigh,

                            I have to say I find it hard to believe that this Direct Debit payment is the result of a "sweep" of payments in arrears - How much would the computer know to take from my account? Why did it attempt to take exactly the same amount as my old broadband monthly payment? Clearly the reality of the situation is that this payment simply has not be ceased as requested on many occasions now. I really would appreciate it if you could simply remain honest with me over these matters.

                            Regardless, please find a copy of the additional statement as requested.

                            I would appreciate it if you could inform me of the suggested repayment plan so that we can commence this as soon as possible.

                            Once again, please do not attempt top take any further Direct Debit payments from my account as they will be refused. Once we agree a repayment plan I will set up a standing order from my new bank account as I have stated on numerous occasions.

                            Sincerely,



                            so thats me uptodate

                            Any suggestions
                            When we love, we always strive to become better than we are.

                            When we strive to become better than we are, everything around us becomes better too.

                            Paulo Coelho

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Nice one mocha, will watch out for updates.
                              Go get 'em girl!!

                              Comment

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