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  1. #176
    fandabby's Avatar

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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    No news from his Solicitor since my reply. Find that a little odd since they were insisting he inspected it within 7-14 days which has now passed.

    I assumed they were trying to settle before the 20th June (allocation hearing) which is why they wanted him to inspect within this time frame.

  2. #177
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Good afternoon

    I have found out the the allocation hearing has a (lady) District Judge sitting, how do I address - Madam. Judge, Judge (name) or Your Honour ?


    thanks
    Last edited by fandabby; 15th June 2017 at 13:23:PM.

  3. #178
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    "Ma'am" will do nicely

  4. #179
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Thanks Des, I have Pm'd you ! If you get a minute please will welcome your help. thanks

  5. #180
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Good morning

    Going back over a few of these threads (147 & 148) and the letters from solicitor and my responses are marked without prejudice, so I leave these out of my WS, is that correct?

    Thanks

  6. #181
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    I don't think any genuine offer was made, soreally the WP is a bit meaningless.
    However better to remove those letters from WS, rather than invite any problems.

  7. #182
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Thanks, removed from WS.

    IF asked by Judge on Tuesday if Defendant has attempted to settle before this day, can I talk about the letters I have received from solicitor ? I am assuming not since they are left out of WS, in which case do I say the time only when he offered me cash on 20th April when he turned up ?


    Just want to be clear so i do not mess up.


    Many thanks

  8. #183
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    This is an allocation hearing, so would not expect judge to ask about attempts to settle. If he does just tell him no acceptable offers had been received.

  9. #184
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    I'm back..

    Firstly so nervous and glad got through the hearing
    Secondly thank you Des for all your guidance and words of keep it simple - which I did, only answered specific to what was asked
    Thirdly, thank you Defendant for not showing up - surely that is negative towards him.

    Judge did most of the talking and asked me questions

    I am ordered to list Costs (for damages), breakdown all faults, produce a statement of case which has a last paragraph of statement of truth. All this to be submitted to court and defendant by 26 June.

    I will receive an order from the court but want to get on with it now as 26th is Monday, will need to post today.

    The statement of case to include:
    Alleged faults
    Cronological events
    Legislation under which claim is brought
    How loss is made up

    Also, order for Standard Directions - witness statements detailing all facts related to van and defendant sent to court and defendant 14 days before hearing. This we have done Des.

    Judge has given me permission to use the Dekra report as written evidence of faults. This to be sent to court by 3rd July. It currently in OH name and need to get it changed to my name.

    Judge is allocating to Small Claims Track due to it looking simple and feels it can be handled here. Did I agree - Oh yes I did agree, thank you Ma'am.

    Allocating 2 hours.

    Expectation there will be no solicitors involved.

    I will post in a separate thread for what I need to do next if that is okay

    Many thanks

  10. #185
    fandabby's Avatar

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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Here are the costs:

    Claim form detailed Van £13,995.00
    Additional Cost £1,189.89


    Do I simply do this as a breakdown within the Statement of Case:

    COSTS
    Cost of van £13,995.00
    Inspection Report £199.00
    Wheels/Tyres £576.00
    Put originals back on £10.00
    Vehicle tax @ 6 months £115.00
    Vehicle insurance @ 6 months £219.50
    Insurance cancellation fee £59.00
    Postage fees up to 15/02/2016 £11.39
    TOTAL £15,184.89


    The claim then has the interest and court fee which takes it to £16,155.27. Do I include these above? Court fee £695.68 and the interest was calculated as

    Interest 26/11/16 - 15/02/17 on £15,184.89
    £3.35 x 82 days £274.70


    Many thanks, just want to clarify how I put this forward

  11. #186
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    As for the Statement of Case.

    The Judge said I need to put on the bottom "I believe that the facts stated in these Particulars of Claim are true"

    Within this Cost, Breakdown of alleged faults, cronological events, legislation under which claim is brought.

    Faults is easy to list as this is detailed in one of my many letters to defendant.

    Legislation is Consumer Rights Act 2015 Chapter 2 Section 9, 10 and 11, Consumer Rights Act Chapter 2, Section 19 and 20 and Consumer Rights Act Chapter 2, Section 19, Sub Section 11.

    This covers not fit for purpose, be of satisfactory quality or as described
    Right to short term right to reject
    Under the 30 days
    lastly Damages

    Do I just list the legislation or title it too?

    Cronological events - I can take this from WS - but my WS is long with all the letters I sent him, do I list all and how much detail do I use ?

    Sorry for all these questions but know I need to get this sorted in the next couple of days and want to post it Thursday to get there Friday in time for Monday deadline.

    Have to get kids now but will draft something later and put it up for comments, if that would be okay.

    Many thanks

  12. #187
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Here is a document I have put together for the Statement of Case.

    No idea on layout but assumed needed to be similar to Witness Statements.

    Judge asked for more details and to include:

    - defects alleged
    - chronology of events
    - legislation under which claim is brought
    - how loss is made up

    She said my original POC is very short and she is aware that you cannot put much in anyway with space limit but needs all this information detailed to understand the claim.

    I have put this together and would like comments please as need to get it done and posted as needs to be at the court by deadline Monday 26th June.

    I took faults listed in my letters and off Dekra but did not put some comments in like undertray missing for example as is this a fault or observation. I have to send in Dekra report as permission to use as written evidence so is it important that I list everything or most obvious faults.

    Chronology of events. Since WS are being part of the standard directions and will be sent separately I thought this Statement should only list when purchased van, when discovered faults, when rejected, when inspected, when he refuses.

    I listed legislations for claim brought under

    I detailed the claim - total was £16,155.27 - so broke this down.

    Please let me know if this is what the court is looking for.
    Have I done it correctly
    Any amendment suggestions welcome please

    Many thanks

    (she also orders standard disclosure of WS to be provided 14 days before court date which will be sent with orders - this I have already put together)
    Attached Files Attached Files

  13. #188
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    I would put the list of faults at the end. (Note that the missing under tray is a fault. undertrays protect engine from water and foreign objects entering ehgine compartment. May also act as diffuser and assist air flow. Design engineers don't include them because they are pretty!!)

    You need to start your document with a statement saying who the parties are, and their position such as: At all material times, the Defendant was a car dealer in the business of selling used cars. The Claimant was at all times a consumer".

    IMO it is better to refer to yourself at all times as "the claimant" as it is less confusing for a third party who might be reading the document.
    I did start to amend but have to go out and running out of time.

    I note you have cancelled the insurance.
    Did the insurers comment on any effect this might have if you revive your possible claim?

  14. #189
    fandabby's Avatar

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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Hi Des

    Thanks.

    Will make amendments and post back up for you to have a look.

    The insurance cancellation fee is if I cancel before 19 November 2017. I put it in as thought this would be finished with by then and once cancelled will have to pay the fee.

    Thanks

  15. #190
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    So list it as "projected" cancellation fee

  16. #191
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    I have uploaded the revised statement of case.

    Please let me know of further suggestions.

    Many thanks
    Attached Files Attached Files

  17. #192
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    I have just amendment this first paragraph point 1.

    instead of buying and selling used cars - it now reads - buying and selling used motor vehicles

    thanks

  18. #193
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Looks fine to me.

    Ready for tomorrow's inspection?

  19. #194
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Thanks Des, I have messaged you this morning about adding another point but not sure whether to.

    What do you think?

    Or leave it as is now ?

    Also should I send this 1st class recorded to the court or special delivery ? I will post tomorrow. Deadline is Monday.

    As for sending a copy to the trader, to his solicitor isn't it since first letter said all correspondence to them. Email it or snail mail with proof of postage ?

    Many thanks, appreciate your help as always.

  20. #195
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Missed that, sorry.
    Might be worth while slipping it in, but omit " and since then I have been an involuntary bailee, since he has not made arrangements to collect his vehicle."

    As judge has specified it must be filed and served by Monday I would send court copy Special delivery (or by hand if court is nearby.)
    Solicitors copy first class but with certificate of posting.

  21. #196
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    As for inspection just going to see if he turns up, then uncover and there is no way the van will start we struggled when we moved it to the back and it is front in so no access for vehicle to jump start it. Will need to be pulled out !
    Do I give him crime report and quote involuntary bailee he should have collected when rejected or rather let him go away and do it through his solicitor ?

    Thanks

  22. #197
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Quote Originally Posted by des8 View Post
    Missed that, sorry.
    Might be worth while slipping it in, but omit " and since then I have been an involuntary bailee, since he has not made arrangements to collect his vehicle." Put it in at the end of chronology of events after listing the CRA legislations and before breakdown of costs ?

    As judge has specified it must be filed and served by Monday I would send court copy Special delivery (or by hand if court is nearby.)
    our local court staff only there on court days (only security there I think normally) otherwise at head office some 50 mins away. I will call there head office and find out if there are clerks around to drop locally before deciding if should post. Managed to get Dekra report sorted too so will post all that off together.
    Solicitors copy first class but with certificate of posting.

    Thanks

  23. #198
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    I would add " When the vehicle was rejected the contract could be treated as at an end (CRA 2015 20 (4); ownership passed back to Defendant "after Para 9. as that is when it happened chronologically

  24. #199
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    Quote Originally Posted by des8 View Post
    I would add " When the vehicle was rejected the contract could be treated as at an end (CRA 2015 20 (4); ownership passed back to Defendant "after Para 9. as that is when it happened chronologically
    Yes that makes sense, thanks

  25. #200
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    Default Re: Court Claim issued, Storm Doris now damaged van UPDATE

    @des8, I have PM'd this but thought I could put it in thread too:

    So got myself in a pickle with these costs.

    I paid the insurance up front full amount £439.
    I put in 6 months as was thinking this would be over within 6 months and yes just did 439 / 12 X 6 to get that figure.


    My full claim amount on the claim form including the interest and court fee comes to £16,155.27.
    If I put in the full premium which is £439 it will take it over total claim amount?

    How do i put these figures in now ?

    This is what is in the statement of case on how I originally worked out the costs back in February for the claim:

    Cost of Van Purchase £13,995.00
    Inspection Report £199.00
    4 x Wheels and Tyres due to cracked alloy and worn tyres £576.00
    Fee to put original wheels and tyres back on for inspection £10
    Vehicle tax @ 6 months (£230 / 12 X 6) £115.00
    Vehicle insurance @ 6 months (£439 / 12 X 6) £219.50
    Projected Cancellation Fee Vehicle Insurance £59
    Postage fees up to 15/02/2016 £11.39

    Sub Total £15,184.89

    The claimant claims interest under section 69 of the £274.70
    County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% a year from
    26/11/2016 to 15/02/2017 on £15,184.89 and also interest
    at the same rate up to the date of judgment or earlier payment
    at a daily rate of £3.35

    Court Fee £695.68

    TOTAL £16,155.27


    ?? What do you suggest and I presume it needs to add up to the £16,155.27 doesn't it ?

    Thanks Des.

    Hoping to get this completed today so I can post special delivery to the court to ensure it is there on time.

    Thanks, appreciate your assistance.

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