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**DISCONTINUED***PRA Group v St Pier

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  • **DISCONTINUED***PRA Group v St Pier

    Received a claim? Yes
    Issue Date: 31/01/2017
    Amount approx: £8660.56 + interest
    Claimant: PRA Group (UK) Ltd
    Solicitor: Surjit Gida
    Original Creditor: Lloyds

    Particulars of Claim: The Claimant claims the sum of 8660.56 for debt and interest. On 1/6/94 the defendant entered into an agreement with LLOYDS for a Credit Card under reference xxxxxxx. On 19/7/11 the defendant defaulted on the agreement with an outstanding balance of 9760.94. On 24/6/13 the debt of 9760.94 assigned to Aktiv Kapiral Portfolio AS, Oslo Zug Branch, who itself assigned the debt to PRA Group (UK) Ltd on 31/12/14. Notices of assignment were sent to the defendant in accordance with S136 Law of Property Act 1925. Payments of 1672.53 received up to 10/03/2016 AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS 1. The sum of 8088.41 2. Statutory interest pursuant to Section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at a rate of 8.00% per annum from 10/3/16 to 27/1/17 572.15 and thereafter at a daily rate of 1.77 until judgment or sooner payment.

    Is the debt Statute Barred? No
    List any letters you have sent: see below
    Any Other Info:



    I do not deny that there is a debt owing to Lloyds , however I had no knowledge that the debt had supposedly been sold to PRA Group.
    • I entered into a dmp around May/June 2010 as I had been made redundant for a second time in 12 months. At the same time my wife was six months pregnant and was also under notice of redundancy. I was advised to enter into a dmp as I knew I would not be able to meet all my debts.
    • The Lloyds credit card was included in the dmp in approximately June/July 2011. I decided to include this because although I had found employment I was earning a salary £14,000 less. My wife had also been made redundant in December 2010 and therefore without her £25,000 per annum salary we were some £40,000 a year less well off. I found that I could not make the monthly payments required by Lloyds and therefore incorporated the debt into the existing dmp.
    • I was notified in early 2016 that the company I had been using for the dmp was no longer authorised by FCA to act therefore I had to make alternative arrangements.
    • I received first correspondence from PRA Group on 10/05/2016 advising that they had not received my monthly payment via the debt management company. This is the first I was aware of their involvement.
    • On 6/6/2016 I wrote to PRA a notice of conditional acceptance letter. This letter requested the original instrument of indebtedness or proof that the said instrument still exists. It also requested either copies of any bilateral or trilateral contracts or deed or assignment. I wanted to verify whether any claim made against me is lawful. The letter stated a request to provide evidence of my liability and stated that I am happy to effect payment upon receipt of the above mentioned documents.
    • On 10/6/2016 I received a letter from PRA. The final paragraph of their letter stated "in relation to your request for information we have contacted the original creditor for a copy of the requested documentation. The account has been placed on 'hold', which means no further collection contact will take place until we have provided a copy of the documentation to you".
    • Included with their letter was a leaflet entitled 'requested information about your original credit agreement?'. At the footer of the document is the document reference CCA Consumer Factsheet v2, last updated 13/03/2015. With this leaflet it states 'if you still owe us money and you don't get what you are entitled to after 12 working days then your debt is classified as 'unenforceable' until you get the information you ask for. Please note that PRA will, in many cases, have to refer to the original to request copies of original documentation which can take longer than 12 days to fulfill'.
    • On 23/6/2016 I sent a further letter to PRA as they had so far failed to provide any of the requested documentation. I once again requested the documentation, giving them 14 days to respond.
    • On 3/10/2016 I received a letter from PRA advising that my account has been passed to their investigations and litigation department to look at my outstanding debt for possible litigation recovery.
    • On 18/10/2016 I received a further letter from PRA, advising that because I had failed to respond to their attempts to contact me their account managers would now start a full investigation in my personal circumstances.
    • On 23/10/2016 I sent a further letter to PRA. The letter referred to my correspondence dated 6/6/2016 and 23/6/2016 and reiterated the documents I was requesting. I stated that as they had failed to produce the documents thus far it was now my understanding that they are party to a fraudulent act.
    • On 31/10/2016 I received a letter from PRA advising that based on their investigations they consider the next course of action to be either legal action to recover the full balance or passing my account to an external debt collection agency to agree a suitable repayment plan with me.
    • On 07/11/2016 I wrote to PRA and requested certified copies of the following documents within 14 days. The agreement/contract, default notice, assignment and formal demand.
    • On 15/11/2016 I received a reply from PRA. They advised that they have requested the required information and that until this is received they have placed my account on hold, which will cease any further collection activity until further notice. This letter was signed by Carissa Turner, head of collections. Attached to this letter was another copy of the leaflet mentioned previously.
    • On 13/1/2017 I received a letter from PRA dated 6/1/2017. This letter advises that once again my account has been transferred to the investigations and litigation department and that this is a letter before claim as required by the Practice Direction on pre action protocols to give me notice of PRA's intention to issue court proceedings.
    • I received claim form from Northampton County Court on 2/2/2017 February for the sum of £9170.56.
    • We have requested the documentation a total of four times and PRA have failed to supply us with anything.
    • At no time were we ever sent a notice of assignment.
    • Although their leaflet states that the debt is unenforceable until they supply the requested documents they have failed to supply these or state in writing that they are unable to supply the documents.



    I apologise for the lengthy posting but I wanted to make you fully aware of all correspondence. What should I do with regards to the summons? Do I need to send CCA request and CPR 31.14 request seeing as documents have already been requested 4 times already?

    Many thanks







    Tags: None

  • #2
    Re: PRA Group v St Pier

    Hi there

    Ok so youve made a request for a copy of the documents mentioned in the Claim form and nothing has been forthcoming?

    Can i ask please if you have made a request under s78 Consumer Credit Act? This is where you send a letter and the fe of £1.00? if you have done so then the PRA group may have a few problems, however if you havent made a s78 request then i would advise making on now.

    With regard to the Claim, i think at this stage you cannot really do anything other than defending the Claim so i would suggest acknowledging service and defending the Claim. Id also suggest asking for an extension of time under CPR 15.5 to file your defence as you cannot possibly prepare without the documents, id be surprised if the PRA group refuses this request
    I work for Roach Pittis Solicitors. I give my free time available to helping other on the forum and would be happy to try and assist informally where needed. Any posts I make on LegalBeagles are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as legal advice. Any advice I provide is without liability.

    If you need to contact me please email me on Pt@roachpittis.co.uk .

    I have been involved in leading consumer credit and data protection cases including Harrison v Link Financial Limited (High Court), Grace v Blackhorse (Court of Appeal) and also Kotecha v Phoenix Recoveries (Court of Appeal) along with a number of other reported cases and often blog about all things consumer law orientated.

    You can also follow my blog on consumer credit here.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: PRA Group v St Pier

      Originally posted by pt2537 View Post
      Hi there

      Ok so youve made a request for a copy of the documents mentioned in the Claim form and nothing has been forthcoming?

      Can i ask please if you have made a request under s78 Consumer Credit Act? This is where you send a letter and the fe of £1.00? if you have done so then the PRA group may have a few problems, however if you havent made a s78 request then i would advise making on now.

      With regard to the Claim, i think at this stage you cannot really do anything other than defending the Claim so i would suggest acknowledging service and defending the Claim. Id also suggest asking for an extension of time under CPR 15.5 to file your defence as you cannot possibly prepare without the documents, id be surprised if the PRA group refuses this request
      I would also suggest that you make a SAR request under the Data Protection Act 1888 to Lloyds and Aktiv Kapital. They have 40 days to comply and provide you with the docuemntation - there is a £10 fee you need to include with the request.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: PRA Group v St Pier

        Your detailed first post is really helpful

        I can see you were in a DMP for around six years (2010 - 2016). Nevertheless the creditor must serve you (not the DMP provider) with all the required statutory notices.

        I can see you were surprised to learn from PRA that they owned the debt after your DMP provider went out of business in 2016. This suggests that you didn't receive a Notice of Assignment from Aktiv Kapital when they purchased the debt in June 2013. (I can see your Lloyds credit card was included in your DMP from June 2011.)

        The debt was then subsequently assigned to PRA in December 2014 so did you receive any NOA from them at the time, although I note that you were still in your DMP until early 2016?

        Have you been receiving Annual Statements since 2010?

        Do you recall getting a Default Notice from Lloyds in July 2011 or at any other time?

        This is the reason why Jo has suggested you send a SAR to both Lloyds and Aktiv Kapital (now PRA) so you can see who sent what to whom and when (if at all).

        I see that your DMP provider is no longer trading as a DMP business, but if the company still exists (not in administration etc) then I would be tempted to send a SAR to them so you can see if any statutory notices were sent to them when they should have been served on you.

        Di

        PS I'm taking most of those dates from the Particulars of Claim so they may not be entirely accurate
        Last edited by Diana M; 8th February 2017, 08:40:AM. Reason: typo

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: PRA Group v St Pier

          Thank you all for your comments. We are pretty sure that we received a default notice from Lloyds, as we knew that the loan would definitely default. What we cannot recollect receiving is the notice of assignment. We had never heard of PRA Group until the dmp stopped. Do you still suggest that we send SAR request to Lloyds and Aktiv Kapital?

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: PRA Group v St Pier

            Originally posted by Vicky2212 View Post
            We are pretty sure that we received a default notice from Lloyds, as we knew that the loan would definitely default. What we cannot recollect receiving is the notice of assignment. We had never heard of PRA Group
            May I just check something

            The POC which you posted at the start of this thread refer to a Lloyds credit card but you refer to a loan.

            You also say "we" so could this have been a joint loan or was it a credit card in your sole name?

            Di

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: PRA Group v St Pier

              Originally posted by Vicky2212 View Post
              Do you still suggest that we send SAR request to Lloyds and Aktiv Kapital?
              Yes

              Nothing has changed.

              The Aktiv Kapital SAR should go to PRA since they acquired AK.

              Di

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: PRA Group v St Pier

                Originally posted by Vicky2212 View Post
                • On 6/6/2016 I wrote to PRA a notice of conditional acceptance letter. This letter requested the original instrument of indebtedness or proof that the said instrument still exists. It also requested either copies of any bilateral or trilateral contracts or deed or assignment. I wanted to verify whether any claim made against me is lawful. The letter stated a request to provide evidence of my liability and stated that I am happy to effect payment upon receipt of the above mentioned documents..
                • On 23/6/2016 I sent a further letter to PRA as they had so far failed to provide any of the requested documentation. I once again requested the documentation, giving them 14 days to respond.
                • On 23/10/2016 I sent a further letter to PRA. The letter referred to my correspondence dated 6/6/2016 and 23/6/2016 and reiterated the documents I was requesting. I stated that as they had failed to produce the documents thus far it was now my understanding that they are party to a fraudulent act.
                • On 07/11/2016 I wrote to PRA and requested certified copies of the following documents within 14 days. The agreement/contract, default notice, assignment and formal demand.


                Do I need to send CCA request and CPR 31.14 request seeing as documents have already been requested 4 times already?
                Looking back at your first post I can see that you sent four letters to PRA but not a formal s.77-79 CCA Request together with a £1 postal order for the statutory fee.

                You asked whether you should do that now as well as send a CPR 31.14 Request. The answer to your question is 'Yes'. Send both right away.

                Since you've said the claim form has been signed by Surgit Gida (Interim Head of Litigation for PRA) as Legal Representative this means PRA has not instructed external solicitors so everything should go direct to PRA using the address given on the claim form.

                Di

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: PRA Group v St Pier

                  Hi
                  Firstly apologies for the delay in replying.

                  To clarify it is a credit card debt which is in my name only.

                  kind regards.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: PRA Group v St Pier

                    Hi

                    Firstly I apologies for the delay in responding.

                    The £1 payment, where should this be sent and can I issue a cheque and if so who should it be made payable to?
                    How exactly do I request an extension and again who do I send this to?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: PRA Group v St Pier

                      Originally posted by Vicky2212 View Post
                      The £1 payment, where should this be sent and can I issue a cheque and if so who should it be made payable to?
                      How exactly do I request an extension and again who do I send this to?
                      See my earlier post (# 8) on 7th February which hopefully answers your questions


                      Originally posted by Diana M View Post
                      Looking back at your first post I can see that you sent four letters to PRA but not a formal s.77-79 CCA Request together with a £1 postal order for the statutory fee.
                      Originally posted by Diana M View Post

                      You asked whether you should do that now as well as send a CPR 31.14 Request. The answer to your question is 'Yes'. Send both right away.

                      Since you've said the claim form has been signed by Surgit Gida (Interim Head of Litigation for PRA) as Legal Representative this means PRA has not instructed external solicitors so everything should go direct to PRA using the address given on the claim form.
                      Di

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: PRA Group v St Pier

                        Hi

                        Requesting an extension was recommended. How exactly do I do this?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: PRA Group v St Pier

                          Originally posted by Vicky2212 View Post
                          Requesting an extension was recommended. How exactly do I do this?
                          That's a tricky question to answer

                          All I know is that I (personally) didn't recommend that you should request for an extension of time. My firm likes to get on with things. More time is more opportunity to create reconstituted documents.

                          However on the 7th February I did suggest that you should send a s 77-79 CCA Request and it appears that you've not yet done that. I also suggested that you send CPR 31.14 Request and you've not yet done that either.

                          But then again according to your first post you have already asked PRA four times for the credit agreement and other documents in the last year (or before). So the question is: do you need to give them any more time?

                          Without seeing the paperwork between you and PRA it's difficult to know what to suggest.

                          If you're using template letters off the internet then make sure you read and understand them before you send.

                          Your Defence deadline is 33 days from the claim Issue Date which you say was 31st January 2017.

                          Di

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: PRA Group v St Pier

                            Hi, I have received a letter from PRA advising that they are withdrawing the recent legal action against me.

                            I would just like to thank you for all your advice and help on this matter.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: PRA Group v St Pier

                              Originally posted by Vicky2212 View Post
                              I have received a letter from PRA advising that they are withdrawing the recent legal action against me.
                              That's good to hear

                              Do you mean that PRA have sent you a Notice of Discontinuance perhaps after you sent them a s.77-79 CCA Request?

                              I can't see anything about you filing a Defence so can you just clarify if you did.

                              Di

                              Comment

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