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Thread: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

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    Default Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Morning all,

    Here I am back on the site after the fantastic help I had last time to clear what I thought was the last of my debt!

    I'm having a lot of trouble with Jacobs based on a 5.5-year-old parking fine!!! It's now going to cost me nearly £500! Is there anything I can do?

    The short yet long story is as follows:

    Apparently, I got a parking ticket back in 2011 which the council believe I contested at the time (I have no recollection of this). It has somehow laid dormant until December last year when a lovely Jacobs letter turned up, asking for around £200 to collect the parking ticket.

    Obviously, I contested this as it was 5.5years ago and I did have problems around 2011 when I sold this car and wanted to check it was actually me that owed the money. Jacobs advised that to prevent any further action I needed to make a contribution towards it otherwise extra charges would have been added and collection of any vehicle at the property would proceed if I didn't.

    I gave them a £40 nominal fee that I was told I could claim back from the council should it not be me who owned the vehicle at this time.

    I then contacted the council asking for details around the alleged offence and they were meant to be sending me proof whilst I cross-checked it with my records of selling the car.

    Nothing happened until last week when Jacobs now want £400 and hand delivered the note plus sent me a text message!

    How does a £60 parking fine escalate to this? Is there anything I can do? It's got to the point where i don't care if i owned the car or not I want it gone but at the lowest price possible!

    HELP PLEASE!!!

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    It seems that the debt has risen because a personal visit has now been made to your property. That visit would have incurred a £235 enforcement fee.

    I am not at all in favour of councils dragging out these historic parking debts but that is probably beside the point right now.

    It is now for you....and not Jacobs....to resolve this matter. You must find out the date of the alleged contravention and see whether or not this was before or after you sold the vehicle (involved in the contravention).

    In most cases, if you have no recollection of receiving notices from the council you should be submitting an Out of Time witness statement with the Traffic Enforcement Centre. The problem that you face though is that the council seem to have records stating that you have appealed the ticket.

    Have you asked the council or Jacobs for the date of contravention? This must be your starting point so as to ascertain who is the liable party.

    Please post back once you have obtained this information.

    In the meantime, and until this is resolved, you need to be aware that your current vehicle (if you have one) is at risk of being seized.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Hi Milo,

    Thank you for coming back to me so quickly.

    From what I can fathom, it seems like it was me. The dates are within a week of it being sold (Always the case isn't it!!!)

    Is there anything I can do to reduce the cost? It seems ridiculously high considering the first i hear of it 5 years on is from Jacobs with hefty fines attached?

    I haven't moved address and it is the address the car was registered too. So i don't understand how it has taken them so long and why i haven't heard anything before Jacobs contacted me. Which i took immediate action and paid a nominal sum whilst it was put on hold to be investigated and Jacobs seem to think they can just add £235 whilst its being disputed.

    I want to get it cleared but I can't afford £500!

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    As I said in my earlier post, an Out of Time witness statement can be submitted if you genuinely cannot recollect receiving the Notice to Owner. All bailiff enforcement will then be placed on hold of approx 6 weeks.

    Given that the council seem to have records indicating that you 'appealed' the PCN 5 years ago, I would not expect that the application would be accepted. However, the 6 week 'grace period' should hopefully allow you time to challenge the council on the length of time that they have taken to enforce this PCN.

    PS: Over the past couple of days I have been receiving enquiries about 'historic' PCN's from 3 London Boroughs. In once case, the PCN originates from 2008 !!! I am not in favour of this new initiative at all.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    I've just contacted the council to get more info around the PCN and my "appeal".

    They've said that Jacobs shouldn't be chasing me anymore as the warrant is closed as it's older than 12months.

    So i can't file a Out of Time witness statement as there is no case there?

    I've then called Jacobs who say it doesn't matter what the council say as the matter is with them?

    What should i do?

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Speak with the council ASAP.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    I've spoken to them.
    They said they've updated the case file but i need to speak to Jacobs and it's their decision if they want to pursue.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    I would suggest that you ask the council for the date that the warrant had been authorised. It is only valid for 12 months.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Milo - They gave me that.
    15/10/15 - So i don't get why Jacobs won't back off.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Quote Originally Posted by treborh2812 View Post
    Milo - They gave me that.
    15/10/15 - So i don't get why Jacobs won't back off.
    Probably because you gave them £40.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Haddock View Post
    Probably because you gave them £40.
    More likely because the warrant is not "only valid for 12 months".

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Quote Originally Posted by treborh2812 View Post
    Milo - They gave me that.
    15/10/15 - So i don't get why Jacobs won't back off.
    The warrant should be valid for 12 month. However, if a payment arrangement in made during this period and the agreement defaults....the 12 month period will be taken as being from the date of default.

    In your particular case, did you make the payment of £40 before the warrant should have expired (15th October 2016)?

    If it is the case that the warrant is still valid, then you may still submit an Out of Time witness statement. It will most likely not get accepted (just over 60% are currently rejected), but it will put the matter on hold for approx 6 weeks and that period will give you an opportunity to hopefully make further enquiries with the local authority.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Post April 6 2014 (almost 3 years ago), changes and repeals have been made governing how road traffic debts are recovered.

    It is no longer the case that the warrant determines when a debt may be enforced. It is now the case that a "power to enforce" is determined by the date on a Notice of Enforcement, which is given to a debtor by the enforcement agent.

    By way of example, a warrant may be dated 1st January 2016. The Notice of Enforcement may be dated 21st January 2016. In this scenario, just because the warrant reaches 12 months on 1st January, it doesn't mean that enforcement is extinguished. The power continues until the 21 January.

    The OP needs to reference the date on the Notice of Enforcement sent by Jacobs as they have the power to enforce for 12 months from this date. The date that the warrant was issued is irrelevant.

    That said, it is vital to obtain a chronological history of this case. It has clearly begun life prior to the April 2014 changeover. This needs to be done in writing, with a copy sent to Jacobs. It would also do no harm to ascertain from Jacobs, when they received instructions to enforce this debt and a copy of the Notice of Enforcement that they sent to you.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Quote Originally Posted by Busyboddy View Post
    Post April 6 2014 (almost 3 years ago), changes and repeals have been made governing how road traffic debts are recovered.

    It is no longer the case that the warrant determines when a debt may be enforced. It is now the case that a "power to enforce" is determined by the date on a Notice of Enforcement, which is given to a debtor by the enforcement agent.

    By way of example, a warrant may be dated 1st January 2016. The Notice of Enforcement may be dated 21st January 2016. In this scenario, just because the warrant reaches 12 months on 1st January, it doesn't mean that enforcement is extinguished. The power continues until the 21 January.

    The OP needs to reference the date on the Notice of Enforcement sent by Jacobs as they have the power to enforce for 12 months from this date. The date that the warrant was issued is irrelevant.

    That said, it is vital to obtain a chronological history of this case. It has clearly begun life prior to the April 2014 changeover. This needs to be done in writing, with a copy sent to Jacobs. It would also do no harm to ascertain from Jacobs, when they received instructions to enforce this debt and a copy of the Notice of Enforcement that they sent to you.
    Confused a bit by this. Without asking too much, could i get a step by step guide of what to do? I'm getting a text saying i have 48hrs to pay before they remove goods?

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    If the warrant is still valid, then the correct course of action should be for you to submit an Out of Time witness statement to the Traffic Enforcement Centre.

    Also, what date did you make the £40 payment to Jacobs?

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    I'm still awaiting a call back form the council and when I called back today the Supervisor wouldn't speak to me as he was going home in 10 minutes! FUMING!!!

    Spoke to Jacobs again, they say it's open and believe I defaulted on a payment scheme, which I believe I was tricked into having when I was convinced to make a nominal payment to prevent door step action and further charges.
    They offered to listen to the call but guess what.... they can't find it so any advanced charges apply.

    This just seems like a huge scandal, even if the PCN is mine the way it's been dealt with is shocking! Appearing after 5 years charges added when ever they like and the council not interested in speaking to me! The advisor on the phone told me Jacobs is my problem and I need to update them not the council! As if Jacobs will believe me when I say it's closed!

    I believe I made that "nominal" payment whilst the warrant was valid!

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    If payment was made within the 12 month period from the Notice of Enforcement, then the warrant has not expired.

    As I have said a few times, you are entitled to submit an Out of Time witness statement.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Thanks Milo.

    I'm going to do that... and i have a bit of instruction how to?

    My main gripe at the moment is that if I am liable for the fee (once the DVLA confirm when i sold the car) I now have to pay £340 for it as Jacobs have, in my eyes, falsely entered me into a payment plan by making me pay £40 to prevent door step action.

    Speaking to them today they said that this payment must have been a payment plan but I was never made aware of any further payments until i had proved who the PCN belonged too. I am no longer allowed a payment plan and its £340 or goods removal.

    I've tried to be reasonable and offer them the full £100 that would be outstanding from the initial contact as soon as I've had the letter from the DVLA but they won't give me that courtesy and have magically lost the call logs!

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Quote Originally Posted by treborh2812 View Post
    Thanks Milo.

    I'm going to do that... and i have a bit of instruction how to?

    My main gripe at the moment is that if I am liable for the fee (once the DVLA confirm when i sold the car) I now have to pay £340 for it as Jacobs have, in my eyes, falsely entered me into a payment plan by making me pay £40 to prevent door step action.

    Speaking to them today they said that this payment must have been a payment plan but I was never made aware of any further payments until i had proved who the PCN belonged too. I am no longer allowed a payment plan and its £340 or goods removal.

    I've tried to be reasonable and offer them the full £100 that would be outstanding from the initial contact as soon as I've had the letter from the DVLA but they won't give me that courtesy and have magically lost the call logs!
    Make sure your current motor is well away or in a locked garage, Jacobs will clamp and seize. even third party cars.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Quote Originally Posted by bizzybob View Post
    Make sure your current motor is well away or in a locked garage, Jacobs will clamp and seize. even third party cars.
    I don't live at the address they are going to, it's a relative of mine. Will they still do this to them?

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Quote Originally Posted by treborh2812 View Post
    I don't live at the address they are going to, it's a relative of mine. Will they still do this to them?
    If they have that address for you there is a good chance that Jacobs will clamp their motors, saying it is reasonable to believe any car parked there is yours, as they have you down as living there and then the relatives would need show V5 and insurance in their name to Jacobs, if Jacobs refuse proof they will need to do a S85 third party claim, or possible interpleader if Jacobs get arsey and actually tow the car(s)

    Milo can probably give clarity,

    Have you given your current address to snacobs?

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Not yet... not being that helpful so I don't want to give them an easy ride!

    I've filed the out of time statement and I'm waiting on the DVLA to advise when I sold the car!

    My concern is that if the PCN is mine Jacobs believe I've had my chance of payment plan and they have added fees so I've got to cough up £400 in one go!

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    So I've filled the out of time statement and Jacobs seem to have put it on hold for now.

    I've spoken to the DVLA who for some reason aren't being very cooperative and are struggling to give me a definitive answer to if I owned the car on that date.

    Is there anything else i can do with the council to challenge this or even get the amount reduced to a manageable amount that i can pay off should it come to that?

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Have you sent the Out of Time witness statement by post or by email (email hopefully).

    If so, then all enforcement of the warrant should now go 'on hold' for approx 6 weeks. That should hopefully give you time to get the information from DVLA that you require.

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    Default Re: Jacobs & The Council - Just when i thought i was sorted =(

    Hi milo
    Yes that's happened, my concern now is if the ticket is mine, is there anything I can disputed to lower the £400 outstanding?

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