Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

[paddyhaig]

Am I getting a fair property evaluation? My brother and I stand to co-own a property inherited from our parents. My brother has lived in the property for 10 years. (He has no lease) An evaluation was made on the property with my brother living in it as a 'standing tenant'. I have researched and it appears that properties with standing tenants are valued often 15% to 20% below fair market value. My brother wishes to buy my half from me at 50% of the present evaluation made with a standing (Without a lease) tenant. I believe an evaluation should be made as if the was no tenant. And that price then divided 50/50 would be the fair asking price.
What are the laws and thoughts on this?
It would seem to me that I am being railroaded into selling at a reduced sum because the present (Without a lease) tenant is also potentially a part owner.

[wales01man]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

Do you need to sell if not you should be able to claim rent from him

[MissFM]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

Paddy, I've had a bit of an idea (forgive me if it's a glimpse of the blindingly obvious)

From what you said on one of your other threads, you also jointly inherit the house your mother lived in which I believe you said is a broadly very similar property.

Do you think you could agree that you had that one and your brother the one he lives in? That would seem fair and go some way to clearing the log jam - if there's anything further you can just split it quid pro quo. x

[paddyhaig]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

The house my mother lived in that is not so much being contested as it sits there rotting away unkempt loosing value every day is about 4 times the value of the flat (Also part of my mother's estate) my brother lives in. The flat has a taxable value based on the land registry documents of £50,000.00 although the value perceived by the real estate agents in their evaluation is £34,000.00. This I can only assume as the flat is valued as is with a sitting tenant and couldn't be renovated or purchased as a property that might be renovated and sold by an investor. As it has a tenant that is sitting pretty. Regardless of his lease status. He is driving the price down. :-(

[des8]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

In one of your other threads I believe you said you now lived in the US of A.
Bearing in mind the cost of lawyers to handle these matters, and the strain of the inevitable stress, have you considered it might be worthwhile accepting the "low" valuation and settling.
The land registration figure of £50,000 is at least 10 years old, and in that time values in UK have remained stationary, if not declined.
The difference is £16,000, of which £8,000 is what you stand to "lose".
Budget in the costs referred to ........... is it worth the hassle?

[paddyhaig]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

The were two evaluations made one on each of the properties. The house was valued by an estate agent at £150,000.00 and a Flat/apartment (That is occupied by my brother without a lease and he's been there about 10 years) valued by an estate agent at $35,000.00 the land registry records value the properties at £150,000.00 for the house and £50,000.00 for the flat/apartment I believe thats a 42% difference on the flat/apartment figures. A clear £15,000.00. Both properties are in the same district very close to one another. With all due respect I fail to believe that the flat has depreciated in value 42% due to a slump in the market when the house has maintained it's value. Something else has to be effecting the value. Is it maybe because the flat has a sitting tenant? I think the evaluation may of been made on the flat under the premise that the tenant may have a valid lease so an investor would find it hard to remove the tenant if they wished to purchase/renovate and resell at a profit. My brother by sitting tight has technically driven down the worth of the property. After my father passed away, my brother stopped paying rent to my mother. Unfortunately my mother was too frail to enforce rent payment. So she let it slide but she wouldn't update the lease. My brother tried to bully my mother into signing the flat over to him. She wouldn't, but would phone me quite distressed and crying. My brother wouldn't take my calls. I live in the USA, if I were to visit the UK to confront my brother about his actions I fear the might be a situation were someone gets hurt or even killed (My brother fancies himself as a bit of a wide boy). I just need to know that I have tried every resource before I concede to this dirt bag. It's not that I want to kick him out on the street. I just want things to be divided equally. Without my brother swaying the figures as it were.

[des8]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

My approach was pragmatic.
If you wish to continue I believe your next move would be to instruct an independent valuer. Bear in mind though your brother may not give him access to the property.

[paddyhaig]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

Thank-you Des8. I'm going to try and track down the last firm that did an evaluation. And ask them how they came about the figures they presented. And if the figures were influenced by the fact the was a tenant.

[MissFM]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

Hi Paddy,

Forgive me, but the tenancy issue is likely to be a red herring. Unless your brother has lived there since before January 1989 - or other historic factors apparently not relevant here are in play - the likelihood of him having a protected tenancy under UK law is, IMVHO, slim to the point of emaciation. Any professional in the UK property market is likely to be aware of this. See here for further clarification: https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...445/138295.pdf

There are plenty of other ways to artificially depress the apparent market value of a property - general grub, grime and poor maintenance, junk, neighbour issues etc..
As you have previously pointed out, spending a few hundred pounds and a bit of effort in tarting the property up to present for sale at its best can have a disproportionate effect, upping the market value by very many times that amount.

You could always offer to buy him out at that low price and see what he says.

It's certainly worth getting a genuine independent valuation (or two) of the optimum estimated sale price at realistic present market conditions with vacant possession.

Your major challenge remains (as you've also pointed out) that you are that side of the pond and he is this side, on the spot and in possession - and that you have no trusted effective legal representation over here.

I do agree with Des that, unless you feel so strongly that you are willing to risk further money and energy in pursuing a (possibly) Pyrrhic victory, the pragmatic approach would be to cut your losses sometime soon. x

[paddyhaig]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

The fact that I am on the other side of the pond, Australia, India, Scotland, Spain or the other side of town should have no relevance. Actually the only vantage being, I am not physically there in a position where my brother and his hoodies might physically and very realistically threaten my well being.
I have had legal representation in the UK that I found to be quite lazy and lackluster in their lack of ability. It seemed to many of my American friends, as one said, "Your whore solicitors, seem to be a classic case of leaving the meter running yet going no where." The level of inefficiency exercised by my solicitors was border line criminal. Please don't read this as me being rude. I am merely quoting some American business friends and acquaintances of mine. In all honesty it's been extremely embarrassing discussing and displaying the UK legal system to my friends and has a tendency to make me feel sick to admit to being British. But alas "I'm a British subject and I try to be proud of it, yet I carry a burden of shame."

[des8]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

know where you're coming from:tinysmile_cry_t:

Complaints about solicitors and their lack of urgency (or any movement forward!) are not unusual on this site.
The fact is you are not here and this does make it more difficult to assert pressure.
We are also very aware of the way solicitors costs ratchet up, and can nullify any gains you might think you are likely to obtain.
Hence the suggestion you examine carefully what you might gain, and the actual costs in attaining that goal.

[paddyhaig]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

I believe that an expatriate still holding a UK passport and the ability to go back to the UK. Should have the rights to PAID legal assistance as any person living on the British isles. For that matter someone of foreign extraction or dweling should also have the right to expect professional service from a licensed UK attorney, lawyer or solicitor. If they are paying for it. I believe in the UK a 'Law license' is required. However not membership of 'the bar' like the United States unless you are a UK barrister. However the quality of service for solicitors is surely held in check or revocation of license may be a factor. I believe this is governed by a body called the SRA. However to get to the SRA you have to go through the Legal Ombudsman. The Legal Ombudsman is a very poorly set up program that easily allows for solicitors of questionable integrity to work their way around the system. But not to digress. I find it pretty shocking that I should have to take a 40% hit to my share of the property value because my brother lives in it (Without a lease) because it would be too expensive to legally arbitrate an equal share. I understand the Law's an Ass, but shouldn't the law be seen to be done?
Again this is no slant on the help and assistance that Des8 has given. Again thank you Des8.

[des8]

Re: Fair property evaluation unfairly biased by tenents conection with purchaser.

You're preaching to the converted