Progressive credit 1st Credit

[overseas]

Can anyone please advise. I held an account with Progressive credit 1990 account which they purchased from a different company. I stopped paying in Feb. 2013 subsequently agreed to a reduced payment but have repeatedly disputed the amount owed or the fact they would not change my address I live abroad. In June 2013 I made an offer of a greatly reduced good will payment with no liability until the outstanding balance and address issues where resolved requesting a copy of the CCA which to this day I have not received despite honouring what I said I would do. On the 25th of January 2014 I received a redirected letter from my old uk address from 1st Credit the usual hello good by letter notice of assignment I contacted Ist Credit in writing on the 3rd of Feb 2014 explained that I was no longer living at the uk address had informed progressive credit numerous times with documented proof that I no longer lived in the uk and requested the CCA and full statement again. 1st Credit changed my address instantly suspended the account saying they would have to obtain a copy of the CCA from Progressive Credit and they where delaying the matter then sent an opening closing balance and claimed they had meet the legal requirements. I have once again informed them that to date May no CCA has been supplied and further requested a certified copy of the deed of Assignment which the refused to supply claiming this was a private matter between them and the Royal Bank of Scotland ( dont know where they come in to the story) I responded that still no CCA had been supplied and they could inform me of the type of Assignment they hold which they have ignored. on the 16th of June I received an e-mail saying they where investigating my complaint which I never made rather asked why they had not supplied what they are legally bound to whilst I am still honouring a good will payment of £5.00 per month.
To date I still have not received a copy of the CCA they will not supply a full statement or a Copy of the Deed of Assignment.
I would be greatful of any advice on how to proceed?
Overseas

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Progressive credit 1st Credit

My first question would be, what are you trying/hoping to achieve?

The deed of assignment is not supplied to the debtor because debts are usually sold in job lots rather than individually and the assignment is a transaction between two parties that does not involve the debtor, however you should have received a notice of assignment.

[overseas]

Re: Progressive credit 1st Credit

Either prove that the agreement is properly executed or desist from harassing me. As I do not believe that there is a CCA as I can never remember signing any agreement and I do not believe that 1st Credit have absolute assignment and are only acting as agents with no legal powers to enforce this alleged agreement I have been lead to believe that there is a ruling regarding deeds of assignment I have copied below.

Lord Denning states in the Pelias Construction Case (Van Lynn Developments v Pelias Construction Co Ltd 1968 (3) All ER 824) where he said the debtor is entitled to "view the sale agreement to ensure that the assignee can give him good discharge under the contract."
ICLR: King's/Queen's Bench Division/1969/Volume 1/VAN LYNN DEVELOPMENTS LTD. v. PELIAS
CONSTRUCTION CO. LTD. (formerly JASON CONSTRUCTION CO. LTD.) - [1969] 1 Q.B. 607
[1969] 1 Q.B. 607
[COURT OF APPEAL]
VAN LYNN DEVELOPMENTS LTD. v. PELIAS CONSTRUCTION CO. LTD. (formerly
JASON CONSTRUCTION CO. LTD.)
1968 Oct. 8, 9
LORD DENNING M.R., DAVIES and WIDGERY L.JJ.
Assignment - Legal - Debt - Notice to debtor - Contents of notice - Whether dare of assignment to be given -
Effect of misstatement in notice - Law of Property Act, 1925 (15 & 16 Geo. 5, c. 20), s. 136 (1).
Practice - Summary procedure under Order 14 - Conditional leave to defend - Whether new wording


To my mind I cannot see that a company can use a law and not be bound to its terms. Further Absolute assingment is vey different to the other forms of assignment.
Your views?

[overseas]

Re: Progressive credit 1st Credit

Hi Flaming Parrot. Sorry post is a bit abrupt we have a massive storm building which usually means the power goes sometimes for hours so rushing to get things done. Thank you for your reply I beleive also under CPR you can ask for disclosure and inspection of documents and they can be redacted for sensitive information such as how much in pennies the DCA has paid . However in this case that is further down the line. As I live abroad I need to be very sure who I am dealing with and on what terms what there powers are and how they can apply them and how I can mount a defence.

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Progressive credit 1st Credit

Hi Flaming Parrot. Sorry post is a bit abrupt we have a massive storm building which usually means the power goes sometimes for hours so rushing to get things done.

It's wall to wall sunshine and sweltering here (posting from sunny London at the moment

Thank you for your reply I beleive also under CPR you can ask for disclosure and inspection of documents and they can be redacted for sensitive information such as how much in pennies the DCA has paid . However in this case that is further down the line.

You can, but I have yet to see someone who has been supplied with the actual deed. As you say, it's further down the line.

As I live abroad I need to be very sure who I am dealing with and on what terms what there powers are and how they can apply them and how I can mount a defence.

They haven't issued a claim, have they? Are they threatening court? I'll be back with a fuller reply a bit later. :thumb:

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Progressive credit 1st Credit

Either prove that the agreement is properly executed or desist from harassing me. As I do not believe that there is a CCA as I can never remember signing any agreement

From what you say, they haven't taken you to court and you are still making payments every month. As long as you make payments, the debt will never become SBd. Nor would you clear it any time soon by paying £5/month. So you basically have to decide whether you want to maintain the status quo, stop making payments to allow it to go SBd or offer them a full & final (provided you can afford it). :decision: If there was never an agreement to start with, the account would be totally unenforceable, in which case there's hardly any point in making payments.

Being from 1990, it's highly unlikely they could supply any sort of recon either. :grin:

and I do not believe that 1st Credit have absolute assignment and are only acting as agents with no legal powers to enforce this alleged agreement

As far as I know, 1st Credit are debt purchasers rather than debt collectors, so they would have absolute assignment and should have sent you a NoA.

One of my credit cards was sold to 1st Credit and they were quick to send a NoA as soon as they bought the account.

I have been lead to believe that there is a ruling regarding deeds of assignment I have copied below.

Lord Denning states in the Pelias Construction Case (Van Lynn Developments v Pelias Construction Co Ltd 1968 (3) All ER 824) where he said the debtor is entitled to "view the sale agreement to ensure that the assignee can give him good discharge under the contract."
ICLR: King's/Queen's Bench Division/1969/Volume 1/VAN LYNN DEVELOPMENTS LTD. v. PELIAS
CONSTRUCTION CO. LTD. (formerly JASON CONSTRUCTION CO. LTD.) - [1969] 1 Q.B. 607
[1969] 1 Q.B. 607
[COURT OF APPEAL]
VAN LYNN DEVELOPMENTS LTD. v. PELIAS CONSTRUCTION CO. LTD. (formerly
JASON CONSTRUCTION CO. LTD.)
1968 Oct. 8, 9
LORD DENNING M.R., DAVIES and WIDGERY L.JJ.
Assignment - Legal - Debt - Notice to debtor - Contents of notice - Whether dare of assignment to be given -
Effect of misstatement in notice - Law of Property Act, 1925 (15 & 16 Geo. 5, c. 20), s. 136 (1).
Practice - Summary procedure under Order 14 - Conditional leave to defend - Whether new wording

If they took you to court then you could use it to challenge the assignment but as they haven't taken that step yet, there's no reason they can't keep chasing you even if they can't prove the assignment.

To my mind I cannot see that a company can use a law and not be bound to its terms. Further Absolute assingment is vey different to the other forms of assignment.
Your views?

Of course it is, but the need to put them to strict proof would only arise if they issued a claim.

[overseas]

Re: Progressive credit 1st Credit

Hi Flaming Parrot. 1st credit have been very professional up to a point. They did supply a NoA photocopy from both companies in same envelope . As soon as I informed them of my new address they updated their files and when I requested a CCA and they could not supply they wrote to me suspending the account. They are not threatening court or any action at present other then investigating my complaint (not made).
Which they will respond to in 8 weeks? Time to find or recon was my thinking.
Should I still be receiving default notices the last one for this account was 13/05/2013 ?
Thank you for your very sound guidance.
I feel at the moment lI am trying to herd cats
For the present it may be wiser just to keep paying the £5.00 as we have 10 creditors most have been sympathetic and are helping but how long their patience last who knows and the 1 or 2 that are not sympathetic are causing great concern.
I would be grateful for fresh advice and help with MBNA - Idem capital securities - Arden. I will post later as have to take the wife for some x rays
Best Wishes Overseas

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Progressive credit 1st Credit

Hi Flaming Parrot. 1st credit have been very professional up to a point. They did supply a NoA photocopy from both companies in same envelope . As soon as I informed them of my new address they updated their files and when I requested a CCA and they could not supply they wrote to me suspending the account. They are not threatening court or any action at present other then investigating my complaint (not made).
Which they will respond to in 8 weeks? Time to find or recon was my thinking.

Even if you don't actually head the letter 'complaint', when you dispute an account on the basis of legal points like CCAs, they will often treat is as a complaint. They are obliged to respond to a complaint within 8 weeks, otherwise you can escalate your complaint to the FOS. That's the principle of it, not that I'd suggest you do that in this case, since the FOS don't get involved in enforceability arguments, leaving that up to the courts. Besides, you really wouldn't want them to come up with something, would you?

Should I still be receiving default notices the last one for this account was 13/05/2013 ?

No, there should only be ONE default notice issued by the original lender when you first broke the contractual agreement by failing to make the agreed repayments. 1st Credit shouldn't be issuing further DNs, nor should further defaults be recorded on your credit file. Only one default per account, even if it does get updated to reflect the new account owner. :thumb:

Thank you for your very sound guidance.
I feel at the moment lI am trying to herd cats
For the present it may be wiser just to keep paying the £5.00 as we have 10 creditors most have been sympathetic and are helping but how long their patience last who knows and the 1 or 2 that are not sympathetic are causing great concern.
I would be grateful for fresh advice and help with MBNA - Idem capital securities - Arden. I will post later as have to take the wife for some x rays

Do start a separate thread with these. :typing:

[overseas]

Re: Progressive credit 1st Credit

Hi Flaming Parrot and all. I think it is best to keep post seperate to each of my issue's. I have decided that I will pay this months good will jesture payment of £5.00 which would be due at the same time as Ist Credits 8 weeks for the investigation, finishes. If they do not provide proof I will inform them cease payment and ask for a refund after all why pay something when you do not owe it? I am sure a court would view matters the same way.
Will keep informed
Overseas with best wishes

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Progressive credit 1st Credit

Hi Flaming Parrot and all. I think it is best to keep post seperate to each of my issue's. I have decided that I will pay this months good will jesture payment of £5.00 which would be due at the same time as Ist Credits 8 weeks for the investigation, finishes. If they do not provide proof I will inform them cease payment

I concur with all the above!

and ask for a refund after all why pay something when you do not owe it? I am sure a court would view matters the same way.
Will keep informed
Overseas with best wishes

I'm not too sure about this part, unenforceable merely means the court wouldn't grant them judgment, it doesn't mean you can ask for a refund of the money you have paid. :nono: You can stop making further payments and let it go SBd :thumb:

[overseas]

Re: Progressive credit 1st Credit

Hi again. I would only be asking for the good will payments made to 1st Credit £25.00 in total if they refuse fine at least I have requested.
Not being greedy just forthright!!
Regards Overseas