charging order hearing in need of some advice

[skilganon]

Hi All,

received a claim for a charging order for a ccj that was issued march 2013, i have been expecting something for some time but was hoping to clear a few other things up before it happened, but it is here and i must now deal with it!

a brief history : i had a loan to buy a car for work, everything was fine until i was made redundant, due to the recession. I continued to pay it for 3 months until my funds ran dry. I rang to explain to the OC of my situation and was told " dont worry you are insured " ? anyway long story short, i apparantly had a PPI insurance policy ? and it just so happened that the policy was with the OC's insurance co. anyway i put in a claim , but they kept stalling and stalling , the OC would not enter into any form of agreement. I had a meeting with the rep of the OC at my home and she said you have 2 options , chase them for your payments or apply for a mis -sold PPI as it is clear you knew nothing about it.

anyway the OC's solicitor issued a claim and i defended part of the balance and counterclaimed for my PPI refund or the payments i was due under the policy, as the OC and the insurers were the same company.

not knowing what i was doing i did not adhere to the letter of the cpr rules etc and their solicitor took full advantage my defence was not good and my WS was too long winded as i told the truth from the beginning.

i still had a very good case on the day as they messed up and i had legal advice in the run in to the trial, my solicitor was confident that i may be able to get the judge to not allow them to use their evidence or at worst have them forfeit their costs.
but the judge completely walked all over me on the day and ignored everything i said or did or had done, and awarded them their claim, their full costs and struck out the counterclaim. I have no money to pay so if i lost i was going to make an offer on the day as to what i could afford, but on giving his verdict the judge turned and almost ran from the courtroom
after trial i spoke to my solicitor and told him what happened he kept repeating " he cant do that" , "that is wrong" " you should have had a solicitor in their with you" we will start an appeal.
when i told him it was a circuit judge he went silent on the end of the phone and eventually said if we appeal it will have to go to the court of appeal, you have a very good case but i can only help you over the phone and if you lose it will be in excess of 50k!!
naturally i declined.

so now their solicitor are going for a charging order, it would appear having briefly read the paperwork that they have already got an interim order? i dont know when or how?

any advice or help would be much appreciated

[skilganon]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

Hi all

could really do with a bit of advice on this if anyone out there is able to offer any assistance,

it would appear, that , in a letter from the land registry the applicant claims to have a charging order made by a court ??

could this have happened without my knowledge ? i know about the CCJ , but have heard nothing about any hearing for a charging order ?

i have a 23rd may deadline to reply to the land registry??

the CCJ is in my name only
the mortgage is in both names

[Amethyst]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

They get an interim charging order off the back of the CCJ, which basically is a temporary charge in case you sell up before they get the final charging order.

You should receive notification from the court on a hearing date for making the interim charging order into a final charging order. Also they could have had permission to apply for a charging order in the original judgment. Do you have a copy of that still ? Was it forthwith or installments ?

Have you only received a letter from the land registry ?

[FlamingParrot]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

received a claim for a charging order for a ccj that was issued march 2013, i have been expecting something for some time but was hoping to clear a few other things up before it happened, but it is here and i must now deal with it!

so now their solicitor are going for a charging order, it would appear having briefly read the paperwork that they have already got an interim order? i dont know when or how?

could really do with a bit of advice on this if anyone out there is able to offer any assistance,

it would appear, that , in a letter from the land registry the applicant claims to have a charging order made by a court ??

could this have happened without my knowledge ? i know about the CCJ , but have heard nothing about any hearing for a charging order ?

I'm really sorry I missed this earlier.

If the creditor applied for judgment after October 1st 2012, they can apply for a CO even if you have kept up the repayments ordered by the court.

The first step is to obtain an interim CO which they court will make automatically as long as you have an interest in a property. This does happen without a hearing, and is only intended to stop you from disposing of the property prior to the actual hearing.

Before the CO is made final, there will have to be a hearing which you should attend. Any objections you may have to the CO should be sent in writing to the creditor and the court at least 7 days before the hearing, with supporting evidence.

i have a 23rd may deadline to reply to the land registry??

What are they asking you? Has a date been set for the hearing to apply for a final CO?

the CCJ is in my name only
the mortgage is in both names

This means they can only record a restriction against your interest in the property as opposed to a full CO. :thumb:

[FlamingParrot]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

How much is the amount of the judgment? There are arguments you can put forward but some will depend on the size of the debt.

Arguments you could use are:

• If your property is in negative equity, there would be no point in making a CO
• If your share in the equity is less than the amount you owe, you could argue there's no point in making a CO
• If you have other creditors, it could be argued a CO would give this creditor an unfair advantage, and that it could upset any arrangements you have with your other creditors
• You have kept up the payments ordered by the court so far (provided you have done so)
• There are other ways this judgment could be enforced, for example, via an attachment of earnings (if applicable, only if you are employed)
• If you or someone else living at the property is seriously ill or disabled

[FlamingParrot]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

the CCJ is in my name only
the mortgage is in both names

When the property is in joint names, the other party has the right to tell the court about their objections to the CO and how it could affect them.

With regards to restrictions on jointly owned property, there's a rather long and very extensive thread on the subject, here: http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/....php?t=1839539

[skilganon]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

Hi all,

wow thank you for the responses, greatly appreciated.

the original order was dated 5th march 2013, i have heard nothing from any one since that date, i intended to make an offer on the day if i lost but the opportunity did not present itself, like i say the judge disappeared from court so quickly.

yes i have had all the court paperwork, had it for 2 weeks now,

apparently on the 15th april 2014, a district judge considered the application of the claimant ( judgement creditor) from which it appears

a) a judgement or order on 5th march 2014 ?? ( is this a typo) by the county court business centre ?? ( who are they ) ordered the defendant to pay money to the judgement creditor.

flaming parrot you are correct, i need to submit 7 days prior, also i noticed that i could try and move the case to my home town court,
b) the amount owing is around 17k !!!!

c) the debtor is the owner of or has beneficial interest in ( my home )

and the court orders that:

the application to be heard on 13th june at a court 50 miles away !!

i still have the original order will try and find it and attach it.

no the property is not in neg equity but there is very little equity, not enough to cover the debt, and certainly not enough to cover the debt with my interest in the equity. but how do you prove this?

my wife lives with me, she is not seriously ill, but suffers from type 2 diabetes and is suffering from depression at the moment, struggling with all the debt situation among other things.

we live 50 yds from her parents, her father is 81, has a heart condition and cares for her mother who has advanced alzheimers !! we have to be on call 24hrs should they need help. difficult times, but hey what can you do?

flaming parrot you are correct, i need to submit 7 days prior, also i noticed that i could try and move the case to my home town court, which would vacate the 13th june hearing ? might give me a little more time ?

we have fought long and hard to keep our home, dont want to lose it just yet, not without a fight anyway.

i can and will attach anything that will help, starting with the original order

[FlamingParrot]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

the original order was dated 5th march 2013, i have heard nothing from any one since that date, i intended to make an offer on the day if i lost but the opportunity did not present itself, like i say the judge disappeared from court so quickly.

yes i have had all the court paperwork, had it for 2 weeks now,

apparently on the 15th april 2014, a district judge considered the application of the claimant ( judgement creditor) from which it appears

a) a judgement or order on 5th march 2014 ?? ( is this a typo)

It sounds like it, as it refers to the order form 5th March 2013

by the county court business centre ?? ( who are they ) ordered the defendant to pay money to the judgement creditor.

It refers to the Northampton Business Centre that handles most money claims: http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/nor...on-bulk-centre

by the county court business centre ?? ( who are they )flaming parrot you are correct, i need to submit 7 days prior, also i noticed that i could try and move the case to my home town court,
b) the amount owing is around 17k !!!!

c) the debtor is the owner of or has beneficial interest in ( my home )

and the court orders that:

the application to be heard on 13th june at a court 50 miles away !!

Yes, you could try to get it transferred but you may need to pay a fee to do so, unless you qualify for remission. Form ex160a provides details.

[skilganon]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

Hi all,

please find attached original order

[skilganon]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

hi flamingparott,

no! not the bulk centre,

why did i not receive anything regarding this ? is that the way things work ?

[FlamingParrot]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

flaming parrot you are correct, i need to submit 7 days prior, also i noticed that i could try and move the case to my home town court,
b) the amount owing is around 17k !!!!

c) the debtor is the owner of or has beneficial interest in ( my home )

and the court orders that:

the application to be heard on 13th june at a court 50 miles away !!

i still have the original order will try and find it and attach it.

no the property is not in neg equity but there is very little equity, not enough to cover the debt, and certainly not enough to cover the debt with my interest in the equity. but how do you prove this?

You could always get a couple of valuations to show how much the property would sell for, compare it to your outstanding mortgage, divided by two (assuming equal share).

my wife lives with me, she is not seriously ill, but suffers from type 2 diabetes and is suffering from depression at the moment, struggling with all the debt situation among other things.

we live 50 yds from her parents, her father is 81, has a heart condition and cares for her mother who has advanced alzheimers !! we have to be on call 24hrs should they need help. difficult times, but hey what can you do?

Every little helps, so make sure you include all that information in your bundle. :thumb:

flaming parrot you are correct, i need to submit 7 days prior, also i noticed that i could try and move the case to my home town court, which would vacate the 13th june hearing ? might give me a little more time ?

See above.

we have fought long and hard to keep our home, dont want to lose it just yet, not without a fight anyway.

i can and will attach anything that will help, starting with the original order

You're not going to lose your home. :nono: A charging order merely secures the debt on your home. In theory a creditor could apply for an order for sale, in reality, such orders are very rarely granted, especially for consumer debts under £25k. The fact that the property is jointly owned and the CCJ is for a sole debt would make it even harder for the creditor to obtain one. :thumb:

[Amethyst]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

Hi all,

please find attached original order

Do you have the order for the hearing on 13th June.

[skilganon]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

i also havent mentioned, dont know if it makes any difference, but we have a repossession order on the house ( suspended), which we are paying at the moment, i thought that they may wait until this had been cleared before starting on this route, guess i was wrong.

[skilganon]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

thank you FP,

makes me feel a little better, amethyst thank you, yes i do, am working on that between posts ( lol) will be up as soon as i can

[FlamingParrot]

Re: charging order hearing in need of some advice

please find attached original order

One thing that stands out is that nearly half the amount is made out of costs!

The date on the order is 5th of March 2013, at that time it would have been above the small claims threshold, had it been a few weeks later, it would have been allocated to small claims where there are normally no costs awarded.

Makes me wonder how those costs were assessed.