Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

[shamen]

Im interested to find out more about those of you who are receiving SMS messages from Debt Collection Agencies. I have a lot of SMS industry experience, a lot of contacts in the SMS industry and would like to make sure that texts you have received are conducted in the correct way.

A lot of SMS messages come via third party companies who act like 'post offices' for text messages, however they want to ensure their customers behave correctly when sending messages so this can be used to ensure that DCA's adhere to the rules. Anyone who does not adhere to the rules can be disconnected by these companies until they do, and thats something Id love to get my teeth into.

If you have received a SMS message from a DCA could you please post a reply in this thread with the following information:

1) What number did you receive the message from?
2) If the text had a name, not a number, as the sender did the message itself contain information on how to stop future messages?
3) Have you replied to the messages with the words 'Stop all'?
4) If so, have you received further unwanted messages?
5) Did you grant the DCA permission to text you at any point?

Thanks in advance

*edit* duh at my spelling. can a mod change the title of this thread please?

[shamen]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

So no one is receiving SMS messages from DCAs ?

I have managed to track down Lowells SMS capabilities - the company they use to send messages and the service provider to that company. The service provider is interested in hearing about unwanted SMS being sent via their network.

If anyone has received DCA SMS messages, can you respond or PM me? If you can include in your response:

1) Did you give lowells your mobile number ?
2) If not, was your mobile number listed as a contact with your original creditor?
3) Have you asked lowells to stop sending you SMS messages and they have not?

Im looking to use contacts within the SMS industry to stop DCA's sending SMS messages when they do not have permission to do so.

Cheers!

[SpringerSpaniel]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

1) What number did you receive the message from? Can't remember, it was a long time ago

2) If the text had a name, not a number, as the sender did the message itself contain information on how to stop future messages? No, no such information was provided


3) Have you replied to the messages with the words 'Stop all'? No, I blocked their number as a sender or caller

4) If so, have you received further unwanted messages? See above - no
5) Did you grant the DCA permission to text you at any point? No and I would not do so.

One reason for this is that I have limited use of my hands due to disability and handling SMS messages is extremely difficult for me. I ask peopl not to communicate with me in this way. Most people don't take any notice of this request. Next time I replace my phone, I am going to buy one where this function is not enabled.

Read more at: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read - Legal Beagles Consumer Forum

------------------------------- merged -------------------------------
The DCA concerned were prosecuted by the OFT for various infringements including being unlicensed. I used this in a successful counterclaim for harrassment against the OC, and referred the OC to their regulatory body for this conduct.

[CleverClogs]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

This happened last year; before then, the momzers sent me unsolicited and unwanted emails. Changing my ISP stopped that.

1) What number did you receive the message from?

The number was withheld; the only details provided was "Triton".

2) If the text had a name, not a number, as the sender did the message itself contain information on how to stop future messages?

No, of course it didn't; why should the arrogant buggers tell one that?

3) Have you replied to the messages with the words 'Stop all'?

No number was provided, so no reply was possible.

4) If so, have you received further unwanted messages?

Not applicable.

5) Did you grant the DCA permission to text you at any point?

No, of course I had not. Nor had I given them permission to send me emails, yet they did send me emails and, if I recall correctly, they resumed sending emails a few months after I had rescinded any express or implied permission I might once have granted.

Although Triton Credit Services is supposedly a trading name of RBS plc, there is no mention of Triton Credit Services on any entry in the Data Protection Register.

[shamen]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

Thank you folks for the feedback. Id like to give you a quick update on whats happening so far.

First, as some of you may know, I worked for many years in the SMS industry at what is now the worlds largest SMS network. That company is also the provider of SMS services to many other companies, who then are contracted to all sorts of companies, such as debt management.

If you receive unwanted SMS messages about debt collection, the first thing to do is try to find out who is sending them. Theres a very high probability in the UK that your SMS message was sent via a company called 'mblox' and you can reach their customer care team on 0845 8833 282. If you give them your mobile number and the details of the message you received, they can put you in contact with the company that sent the message (but only if that message was sent via mblox). The details they give you should allow you to contact the company concerned and have them stop all further messages to your number.

I yesterday contacted one such company, called 'collstream' (welcome@collstream.co.uk / 01332292425) who are sending SMS messages on behalf of lowells. I informed them that marketing messages must be 'opt in' and have a way of 'opting out' when requested. A company cannot simply pull phone numbers out of the air and send messages to them to chase debt. Such messages are covered under the Electronic Communications (EC Directive) Regulations 2003 (sections 22 and 23).

This is the mail I sent them

Hello
I have been informed from mblox.com that you are the company responsible for sending me unwanted SMS messages.

I am receiving messages from originator 'Lowell' which are coming via your company. These messages are unwanted and requested.

I note the following about the messages:
- The messages are unwanted
- I have not given the phone number 0xxxx xxxxxx to lowell
- I have not given the number 0xxxx xxxxxx to any company lowell may be working on behalf of
- Lowell have no permission to contact me by phone or by SMS
- The messages contain no way of 'opting out' or replying
- The messages are for someone with a different first name, but same surname, as myself

All of the above put your company, as the originator of the messages, in breach of The Privacy and Electronic Communications (EC Directive) Regulations 2003 (sections 22 and 23).

Please confirm back to me that your system will no longer send these unwanted SMS messages to my number. Please confirm back to me how any future messages you send on behalf of lowell will come with clear opt out instructions, in order to comply with the law.

Failure to respond to or take action upon this lawful request will result in a complaint to the Information Commissioners Office, as well as County Court action to enforce your compliance and seek damages for my time in trying to track your company down and resolve the matter.

So, you think that would be clear cut and dry. Well, it had the correct effect - that is my number has been blocked so Lowell can never send me SMS again, however it was the explanation for why these messages are completely within legislation that made me sit up.

I have blacklisted your number to ensure that you do not receive any further messages.

I would just like to make it clear that Collstream provide SMS messages for business and send them on their behalf. Lowell's are one of our customers that we send for however that is all we do. We do not have access to their database or where they get there data from.

As the messages are not marketing messages they would not require an opt out to them, I believe Lowell's messages relate to a financial account. The regulations also state that if they 100% believe that the number they have is for the person that they are intending to text then they are 100% within their right to text them.

As I said I have blacklisted the number to stop any further texts being sent but I would recommend that you contact Lowell's if you have any further concerns.

The two items in bold above are the ones that got my attention and what Im sure the ICO and OfCom will find most interesting. First, the industry is claiming that SMS messages relating to debt is not 'marketing,' which basically means that no Spam laws apply and any SMS regulation regarding 'opt out' does not apply.

Second, they are claiming that as long as a particular company '100% believe' that a number belongs to you they can SMS it as much as they like.

As a person who was heavily involved in the industry while the rules were being formed, it is clear to me that some loose application of the word 'marketing' is being applied to skirt around regulation in this area. I'm also going to do further digging to see what regulation there is around sending messages on the 'belief' the number belongs to the person the DCA is looking for. In my case, Lowell sent SMS messages for a person with a completely different first name to me, to my wifes handset (though i admit the surname is the same). Clearly they '100% believe' the number belongs to the person they are looking for *sarcasm*

My reply to collstream

Thanks for your email confirmation regarding the removal of my number.

I will look further into the regulations surrounding these particular
types of messages in conjunction with the ICO and Ofcom, as while they
are not 'marketing' in trying to sell a product, its clear that a
hole in the rules is being exploited. Coming from having worked in the
SMS industry myself for many years (I was senior ops at XYZ), I believe
that messages such as these are relying on the term 'marketing' to skirt
around regulations. While the term 'marketing' can be seen as relating
to sales, marketing is also defined as 'business communication' and
'business development,' both of which sending SMS messages to debtors,
or potential debt management clients, could be classified as.

Even in the event that such messages are not classified as 'marketing'
then I will campaign to OfCom very hard for clarification and correct
rules to be put in place.

In this case, Lowells have sent a message for a 'Richard XXXXXX' to a
phone belonging to my wife, Leanne XXXXXX - so I would find it very hard
fetched to believe that this company is 'absolutely certain' the number
is the number for the person they are looking for. I'm also a little
surprised that the rules allow for messages to be sent, unsolicited, to
any mobile handset purely because your customer has a belief the phone
may belong to someone they are looking for, but thank you for that
clarification.

I have started putting out feelers on the debt advice forums for other
people who have been affected by such messages and the lack of ability
to opt out and the mistakes made by debt collection companies. I'm
getting feedback that people are receiving messages on phones that they
have not requested and sometimes people are getting messages for people
they do not even know, so it looks like the case relating to myself is
not an isolated incident. As these people have no way of asking for the
SMS to stop (or have called the company concerned and the SMS messages
keep on coming), such business logic could also be viewed as harassment.

I appreciate that this is part of your business and that your customer
simply supplies you numbers to send messages to, however the ultimate
responsibility for legislation compliance will rest with your company as
the holder of your XYZ 'master service agreement'. I can see that the
legislation is being applied very liberally in this area of the industry
and will seek clarification from the relevant authorities.

Thanks again for your clarification and will keep you posted of any
further developments

[tomlow1]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

Hi

I saw this forum thread after a Google search and hope that someone can help with my trouble!

At the end of August I discovered my ex partner had applied for 13 Payday loans with 11 companies using my identity. However he used his own mobile number and a fake e-mail address to set them up so I wouldn't know about them.

The matter has been reported in full to the police and every loan company has been contacted several times by letter and e-mail. From this 5 companies wrote the loans off immediately.

Toothfairy is one company that is being extremely difficult to deal with and refusing to co-operate. The police have contacted them numerous times and they still send out nasty letters demanding ludicrous amounts and not acknowledging the fraud at all. I have reported them to the financial ombudsman.

Last week the police told me they provided ToothFairy with my actual mobile number as a means to speak me regarding the fraud. Instead of this they have entered the number into their system and now use it to text me payment demands daily and ring me excessively to ask for progress on payment or when I tell them it's fraud, more proof.

The texts I receive come from "MHBailiffs" and "NDRecovery" with no sender number.

If theres anything I can do to stop these texts let me know. I did not give them permission to use my number, nor did I even provide it to them. The police have said they provided my number to them on good faith and not to chase a loan that I never applied for as I'm a victim of fraud.

Thanks in advance for any help you can offer.

[Gorang]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

Hi and welcome tomlow

Have you went back to the police and informed them of the messages you are getting as a direct result of them handing out your mobile number

if you did then what was their response

[teaboy2]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

Hi

I saw this forum thread after a Google search and hope that someone can help with my trouble!

At the end of August I discovered my ex partner had applied for 13 Payday loans with 11 companies using my identity. However he used his own mobile number and a fake e-mail address to set them up so I wouldn't know about them.

The matter has been reported in full to the police and every loan company has been contacted several times by letter and e-mail. From this 5 companies wrote the loans off immediately.

Toothfairy is one company that is being extremely difficult to deal with and refusing to co-operate. The police have contacted them numerous times and they still send out nasty letters demanding ludicrous amounts and not acknowledging the fraud at all. I have reported them to the financial ombudsman.

Last week the police told me they provided ToothFairy with my actual mobile number as a means to speak me regarding the fraud. Instead of this they have entered the number into their system and now use it to text me payment demands daily and ring me excessively to ask for progress on payment or when I tell them it's fraud, more proof.

The texts I receive come from "MHBailiffs" and "NDRecovery" with no sender number.

If theres anything I can do to stop these texts let me know. I did not give them permission to use my number, nor did I even provide it to them. The police have said they provided my number to them on good faith and not to chase a loan that I never applied for as I'm a victim of fraud.

Thanks in advance for any help you can offer.

Yes you can send them a letter before action, making it clear to them that the loans were taken out fruadleuntly by your ex partner, and providing them with your crime reference number that the police give you. While at the same time informing them that their barrage of text message and phone calls for them or DCA's acting on their part, are now deemed as harassment by you and they're liable for the actions of those acting on their behalf, and as such if they do not cease the calls, texts messages, emails and/or letters demaning payment for a debt that you never owed, within the next 7 days, then you will commence legal proceedings against them under the protection from harassment act 1997 and the consumer protection from unfair trading regulations 2008. Make it clear that under the protection from harassment act, any such acts of harassment are a criminal offence that can result in a custodial sentence.

As for tooth fairy themselves, you should also report them to the OFT as they are a well known bunch of halfwits that regularly break the rules and to be honest are not fit to hold a credit license.

[labman]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

Did you give the police permissionto pass on your data. If not I'd be straight in touch with the Chief Constable about their breach of the DPA, along with the consequences of that breach, asking him how he intends to remedy this situation now they have your number and you are now the victim of harassment because of them.

[Kungfucharlie]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

Hi

I would like to know if SMS messages sent by supposed debt collection/credit agencies can be used as a legal attempt at contact, even if the messages do not contain my name or any reference as to what the SMS messages relate to, to me personally?

Please see an example of an SMS sent by a company called MMF below;

"Formal NOTICE OF LEGAL ACTION: unless we hear from you within 7 days on 01274 631000. We will rely upon this SMS when legal costs arise. MMF Ref:M149644"

Any advice/opinions welcome!

Kind regards

Kungfucharlie

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

Hello kungfucharlie!

welcome to Legal beagles if you havent already been always nice to see a new face!

MMF are very well known to us, infact this post is an answer to a prayer in a way

as far as I know its not legal as you have not given them permisson to contact you via sms. How can they prove they sent it to the right person? May I forward your post to my friend Teaboy who has interest in this company?

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

deleted wrong thread

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

deleted wrong thread.

[Galahad]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

I don't see how these SMS messages can remotely be construed as legal.

When they send a letter, there is no indication on the exterior of the letter what the contents may pertain too, so there is generally not a problem with them sending letters to the wrong address, as its an offence to open mail that isn't addressed to you, and obviously the sensitive contents will only reveal once opened.

There is no kind of security or discretion with a text, there is NEVER any kind of assumption that the text might be sent to the wrong person.

Its surely a breach of Data Protection to be sending UNSOLICITED messages of this nature, when the intended recipient is not guaranteed to receive.

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Received a Debt Collection SMS? Please read

all it says is
D) Be circumspect and discreet when attempting to contact the debtor by telephone, SMS, email or by personal visit, with due regard to the Data Protection Act and OFT Guidance.

also its in the CCL application form "how do you intend to contact customers.. phone mail sms.. "
if it loads

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...zEnui0LVJjJU0g