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Natwest Unfair/disproportionate Bank Charges

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  • Natwest Unfair/disproportionate Bank Charges

    Hello All

    Well where to start! I have been having some difficulty with Natwest since about 2009 with regards to bank charges on 2 of my accounts. My main account was bombarded with charges for a couple of years which amounted to well over £3,000 at the time we were in financial hardship and stuck in a relentless cycle of massive charges from them. At the time I did and still do have regular dialogue with Natwest Collection Department as my branch will no longer deal with me or discuss any aspect of my accounts with me (helpful banking indeed!!) After some time I was in he process of commencing a claim with them to re-coup the charges but unfortunately I did not get this together in time before the ruling on this so I had not furthered this.

    My main issue that I have now is in relation to a secondary account which I do not use and is usually almost maxed out and occasionally slips over it;s limit. The last time this happened was when the account slipped over it's agreed O/D limit of £500 pond due to the interest being added one month. Between April 09 - April 10 this account slipped over by £6; this then started a relentless cycle of charges at the time we were really struggling with money and daily/weekly pleading to Natwest Collections department to please stop the charging to allow me to get on top of it resulted in nothing positive emerging. I argues to them that if they would please just give me a chance then I could perhaps get on top of matters and bring the account to within it's limit and continue to reduce it. The Birmingham collections team were the most rude, contentious argumentative and aggressive people I think I have ever come across!!

    This Apr09-Apr10 period eventually resulted in me being £453 over the agreed O/D limit and with a variety of what I consider to be underhand tactic employed to force me to pay. On 2 occasions without any warning they restricted access to our main account completely, we could not draw ,money from it or access it online; which left us with absolutely no money available to buy food etc (we have a young child) and access our means tested benefit. When I spoke to them they basically said that they had done this as a means to encourage me to address the problem on the secondary account which was over it agreed over draft limit. Eventually I had to borrow some money from an elderly relative and pay a bit back whilst setting up a payment plan to pay back the whole amount of £453 which was made up entirely of charges on charges and a few default notices as well, even through I was protesting that I thought this was grossly unfair.

    Now once again in Feb this year the second account slipped over it's £500 limit by£4.93. This resulted in a charge of £20. At the same time in feb I was speaking to the collections team to set up a capping arrangement on my mortgage as I had for the first time missed a mortgage payment over Christmas. This resulted in me completing an I&E details with them over the phone which initially indicated that we were indeed in financial difficulty and they would not put the capping agreement in place until we re-jigged the figures to their satisfaction, as agreed with them at this time I also transferred £35 into this secondary account to bring it within it's limit. Once again with interest and another charge in March this account has slipped over it's £500 llimit to £527. I was intending to transfer some more in as soon as I could however now this April they have stung me with an £84 charge to now bring this acc to £618 - £118 over it's agreed O/D limit.

    I phone the collection department the other day to discuss this and complain that this latest charge of £84 was completely unfair and disproportionate to any true cost to the bank. The chap I spoke to was as usual most unhelpful and told me he could not explain how this charge was justified and that basically as far as he was concerned if I did not agree to pay it there and then or at least set up a plan then he would register it as a 'no deal' and pass it to their recovery dept which would most probably result in the bank closing all of my accounts.

    I do not want them to close my accounts (although I do intend to get them out of my life completely one day). I do however feel that it is unfair. I know it is my responsibility to keep my accounts in order, however I am struggling. I am sick and tired of being financially raped and extorted by Natwest, for the past 3 years I have been in a regular dialogue with the collections centre and regularly been at the receiving end of their bully boy tactics. Do I have to once again have to lie down and accept their outrages charges or is there grounds to dispute this with banks on the basis of fairness/being disproportionate??

    Sorry for ranting, i hope i have been clear enough,I am just at the end of my tether with them now any advice would be so much appreciated

    Many thanks in advance

    Kowalski123
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Re: Natwest Unfair/disproportionate Bank Charges

    :bump2:
    CAVEAT LECTOR

    This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

    You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
    Cohen, Herb


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    gets his brain a-going.
    Phelps, C. C.


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    The last words of John Sedgwick

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Natwest Unfair/disproportionate Bank Charges

      Originally posted by kowalski123 View Post
      Hello All

      Well where to start! I have been having some difficulty with Natwest since about 2009 with regards to bank charges on 2 of my accounts. My main account was bombarded with charges for a couple of years which amounted to well over £3,000 at the time we were in financial hardship and stuck in a relentless cycle of massive charges from them. At the time I did and still do have regular dialogue with Natwest Collection Department as my branch will no longer deal with me or discuss any aspect of my accounts with me (helpful banking indeed!!) After some time I was in he process of commencing a claim with them to re-coup the charges but unfortunately I did not get this together in time before the ruling on this so I had not furthered this.
      The bank will and have always looked at financial hardship cases. Where the account is £250.00+ over any agreed limit the collections department take over the management ie decision making role of the accounts and I would have thought(although I doubt it) made a provisional assessment as to financial hardship.
      My main issue that I have now is in relation to a secondary account which I do not use and is usually almost maxed out and occasionally slips over it;s limit. The last time this happened was when the account slipped over it's agreed O/D limit of £500 pond due to the interest being added one month. Between April 09 - April 10 this account slipped over by £6; this then started a relentless cycle of charges at the time we were really struggling with money and daily/weekly pleading to Natwest Collections department to please stop the charging to allow me to get on top of it resulted in nothing positive emerging. I argues to them that if they would please just give me a chance then I could perhaps get on top of matters and bring the account to within it's limit and continue to reduce it. The Birmingham collections team were the most rude, contentious argumentative and aggressive people I think I have ever come across!!
      I can't disagree with you to be honest.
      This Apr09-Apr10 period eventually resulted in me being £453 over the agreed O/D limit and with a variety of what I consider to be underhand tactic employed to force me to pay. On 2 occasions without any warning they restricted access to our main account completely, we could not draw ,money from it or access it online; which left us with absolutely no money available to buy food etc (we have a young child) and access our means tested benefit. When I spoke to them they basically said that they had done this as a means to encourage me to address the problem on the secondary account which was over it agreed over draft limit. Eventually I had to borrow some money from an elderly relative and pay a bit back whilst setting up a payment plan to pay back the whole amount of £453 which was made up entirely of charges on charges and a few default notices as well, even through I was protesting that I thought this was grossly unfair.

      Now once again in Feb this year the second account slipped over it's £500 limit by£4.93. This resulted in a charge of £20. At the same time in feb I was speaking to the collections team to set up a capping arrangement on my mortgage as I had for the first time missed a mortgage payment over Christmas. This resulted in me completing an I&E details with them over the phone which initially indicated that we were indeed in financial difficulty and they would not put the capping agreement in place until we re-jigged the figures to their satisfaction, as agreed with them at this time I also transferred £35 into this secondary account to bring it within it's limit. Once again with interest and another charge in March this account has slipped over it's £500 llimit to £527. I was intending to transfer some more in as soon as I could however now this April they have stung me with an £84 charge to now bring this acc to £618 - £118 over it's agreed O/D limit.
      The £84.00 is not just a maintenance charge. Actually scrap that, it's their new charging structure ie £6 a day or 14 days over the limit.
      I phone the collection department the other day to discuss this and complain that this latest charge of £84 was completely unfair and disproportionate to any true cost to the bank. The chap I spoke to was as usual most unhelpful and told me he could not explain how this charge was justified and that basically as far as he was concerned if I did not agree to pay it there and then or at least set up a plan then he would register it as a 'no deal' and pass it to their recovery dept which would most probably result in the bank closing all of my accounts.

      I do not want them to close my accounts (although I do intend to get them out of my life completely one day). I do however feel that it is unfair. I know it is my responsibility to keep my accounts in order, however I am struggling. I am sick and tired of being financially raped and extorted by Natwest, for the past 3 years I have been in a regular dialogue with the collections centre and regularly been at the receiving end of their bully boy tactics. Do I have to once again have to lie down and accept their outrages charges or is there grounds to dispute this with banks on the basis of fairness/being disproportionate??
      You need to re assess your circumstances and write to the bank not about the fairness of charges but with regards to your financial position, priority debts(rent/mortgage, electricity, gas) and how the charges are impacting on your ability to pay for basic necessities. Explain the effect on the charges and ask for help. If you have any DD's set up then cancel them on the NatWest account(I assume mortgage is with them so not really possible to do so. I would be minded to open a basic account elsewhere and to start paying a fixed amount into the accounts in question. Collections people are not exactly the best people to speak to if you are already in trouble since they can appear to be extremely brash.
      Sorry for ranting, i hope i have been clear enough,I am just at the end of my tether with them now any advice would be so much appreciated

      Many thanks in advance

      Kowalski123
      See above and please look at the hardship section of the forum. There is a link on my signature to the lending code and section 9 should be read in entirety.
      Furthermore in the hardship forum there is a blank NatWest I&E form so complete it as much as possible and keep copies of everything you send to them.
      "Family means that no one gets forgotten or left behind"
      (quote from David Ogden Stiers)

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Natwest Unfair/disproportionate Bank Charges

        Many thanks for your response Leclerc, it's very much appreciated and apologies for the delay in coming back to you.

        Well as of today I have had to make an agreement with Natwest, during all the time I have been in a stalemate with them since my last post things have just got worse (although only from my perspective as they have profited!).

        Having had the same conversation with them that I always do, I was informed today that they have added an additional £184 to the current account which was initially overdrawn by £27 due to a charge, then they added an £84 charge which as you say is a daily rate and todays figure is the additional £184, so all in all about £300 worth of charges for no transactions just being overdrawn.

        IN addition to this they have also informed me that the capping agreement which was in place on my mortgage is now broken due to this situation with my current acc. As far as I was aware, the capping agreement was in relation to my actual mortgage and provided that I did not miss a mortgage payment for the next 6 months they would spread the 1 missed payment which I have ever had on it across the entire term of the outstanding mortgage; however today they inform me that because my current acc is in arrears I have broken my agreement and it now the 1 missed payment has to be paid off over the next 6 months. So this is ultimately now going to cost me approx an extra £110 a month all in all! Does anybody know if this is correct I have missed no further mortgage payements and did not know that if my other account was in arrears I had broken this??

        I told the absolutely soulless B******d who I dealt with today that this is absolutely crucifying me and pleaded with him do help me but he was simply just not interested and wanted to secure an agreement. Basically if we do the I&E form and the figures do not tally then they inform me that they pass me to their recoveries Dept who will most probably close my accounts and then register a CCJ against me, if I do not pay. So I go through the I&E form and work it so it appears that I have money and I have to pay this. I thought this was the best thing to do as I really do not want them to completely finish me off financially and I can't see how being passed to their recoveries team will help me long term.

        So Just to stop the amounts/charges increasing daily I have been ultimately forced to accept these charges just to put a stop on it and I will just have to find the money from somewhere to cover this somehow.

        What really gets me is the fact that I am completely over a barrel here and they are just so unwilling to consider that over £300 instant snowball of charges is really a suitable way to address a customer who is struggling with their finances. I am now committed to an extra £100 or so for the next 6 months.

        What seems even more annoying is that I am in effect being completely stitched up by them. Whilst I do feel that i am in financial difficulty I am probably in reality more borderline financial difficulty (although I am sat here with no food/money for the next 10 days!) when you go through a very black and white I&E form which does not really take into account reality then I can make it look like I have a little spare money left after all payments, this is very rarely true through and less so now I am £100 or so worse off a month. But if I try and take matters further with the ombudsman etc they will say their assessment showed I can pay. But then if I don't agree to pay I will ultimately be worse off and financially ruined by them even more so!!

        I will of course be writing to them trying to explain my situation to them, how these charges are affecting me financially (and mentally) as you suggest and my disgust at how this is once again being handled by Natwest and I will address it to the Birmingham collections / complaints etc. And I most probably will write a letter to the ombudsman asking to look at the fairness of the whole situation.

        Is there any point in this though? Is anybody actually interested if it is fair or not? these days they would never increase overdrafts or lend me money in any way but they will agree to in effect lend to me at Extortionate rates with these charges and repayment plans for them. Although I have never even had this money it is all charges upon charges. I really do feel that I am being raped by them and having money extorted from me, they are no better than a thug who knocks on the door using bully boy tactics and telling you if you don't pay they will double it next time (or more than double in this case!)

        Is there any point me going to one of these companies who say they can get charges back, I've now had well over £4,000 I should think and even a slice of it and two fingers up at them would please me, although I don't know if they can still do this for you??

        OK this rant now over! If anybody has any further advice as I how I might address this situation and make some headway with Natwest other than giving them every penny I have or haven't got I would be so very very grateful

        many thanks for taking the time to read this

        regards

        kowalski123

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Natwest Unfair/disproportionate Bank Charges

          Why you spoke to them I have no idea, Why you didn't send in the NatWest I&E in the hardship section of this site, I have no idea. WHY WHY WHY are you ringing them since their calls are NOT recorded? GRRRRR!!!!!

          Use your puter to type up a letter to NatWest and include the I&E(i'll get the I&E for you).
          Send it to natwest and explain your circumstances, ie 10 days and no food, etc .etc.

          EDIT: Legal Beagles Consumer Forum - View Single Post - Hardship - Individual Banks Requirements Who to contact

          Make sure you use the NatWest one and not the RBS one.
          "Family means that no one gets forgotten or left behind"
          (quote from David Ogden Stiers)

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Natwest Unfair/disproportionate Bank Charges

            Why would you make your I/E form look like you have spare money when you haven't?? The whole point is to show that you CANNOT afford to pay them, that you are in financial hardship.

            Check the terms of your mortgage as to whether the capped rate is now broken or not.
            Is no longer here

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Natwest Unfair/disproportionate Bank Charges

              Hello Leclerc / Wendy again thank you for taking the time to provide me with your thoughts on this matter all your advice is so much appreciated.

              Well yes I feel even more stupid now than when I phoned them back yesterday . Basically I made a repayment agreement with them as they phone me every day requesting I pay this back, I tell them they are unjustified and the amounts are too much; they then tell me every day I refuse to pay then the charges go up @ £42 per week, and if I refuse to make any agreement with them they will put it on their system as a 'no deal' and pass my acc to their recoveries dept who will do the same to me and if I still don't pay then they will close my acc's and register a CCJ against me. Basically either way I lose or it will cost me more is their stance

              I have made an agreement with them through their fear mongering as I don't want them to close my accounts and I definitely do not want a CCJ registered against me. Having left this for some time already and disputing it with them they have already added £184 worth of additional charges so I just wanted them to stop and freeze the amount, before it gets even more out of hand. I know to be honest and hold my hands up that I should have got onto this sooner.

              I dont know I suppose I was working on the basis that if I could just get the amounts frozen then whilst I have made agreement with them, I am planning to send in a detailed I&E form and complaint letter to them stating that whilst I have made an agreement I did so under duress and the pressure and threats that they are putting me under to do so. In reality I cannot really afford to pay an extra £110 for the next 6 months which my I& E form will explain and again I am hoping that if I send it to the collections dept and the customer complaints team & the Ombudsman surely they will look at my case and agree that Natwest have acted unreasonably in extorting £300 pounds from me simply because my account has slipped over the O/D limit due to a charge.

              At the time I was putting the capping agreement in place on my mortgage this current acc was over it's limit and the person in collections told me if I pay £30 in to bring it under it's limit all was ok and the capping agreement would be in place for the x1 missed mortgage payment. At the time I paid £35 in and was going to continue filtering money into it to bring it down. Then they hit me with another £27 charge which I was not warned about then an £84 charge and now £184 worth of charges. It just spirals out of control so quickly.

              I will get on to my letter describing how this is affecting me etc and complete my I&E form this evening and get it to them asap. It will definitely demonstrate that I cannot reasonably pay them all of this additional money every month. Do you think that they or indeed the Ombudsman will look at perhaps wiping these charges? The collections team tell me that if I am in financial hardship then my acc will just be passed to the recoveries dept which will ultimately result in the scenario as I have described above, no repayment agreed then acc's closed and default registered against me. I feel that I am between a rock and a hard place!

              What is even more annoying is that I am trying to finish doing up my house so I can sell it and give basically pretty much all my money to Natwest anyway and clear all of my debts (along with a few others I have also!) which is now going to be even more difficult to do as it stands. Depending on how much money I am left with and which I can amass once I have cleared all of my debts then you never know at some point in the next couple of years I may (although unlikely) be looking for another mortgage and I suppose that was also in my mind with the threat of a CCJ's further default notices etc.

              Do you think if I don't get a helpful response from Natwest re financial circumstances etc then the Ombudsman would be willing to look into this matter?

              One again many thanks for your your help

              Comment

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