FOS and bank charges refund

[Amethyst]

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From: "Locke, Jonathan" <Jonathan.Locke@financial-ombudsman.org.uk>

Sent: Thursday, 18 September, 2008 7:04:16
Subject: Case Reference xxxxxxxxxx

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Thank you for your e-mail.

In respect of the guarantee, it is designed to ensure that if a claim is made against the account erroneously, then that money should be paid back to the account straight away with the assistance of the account holding branch. In respect of the circumstances you describe, a claim was made and the payment was 'bounced', meaning that no payment left the account.

In relation to charges, if the debit was claimed incorrectly, or in excess of the amount that should have been claimed, we would normally suggest that evidence is obtained of the charges and this should be presented to the claimant of the debit so they can arrange to consider refunding the charges (if they made a mistake in claiming the debit). We would not normally consider a complaint about bank charges in relation to the error being made by the claimant. We would ordinarily consider the complaint if it is clear that the bank made a mistake. Whilst bank charges are on hold pending the High Court case, if the bank made a mistake and will not refund the payment, then I think we would consider that complaint.

I hope this information is of assistance.

Jonathan Locke

assistant manager

[EXC]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

What was the enquiry this was in response to Ame?

[Amethyst]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

If a direct debit is claimed early resulting in a charge does the ombudsman look at the complaint when its not the banks ''fault'' that the charge is incurred. Its ref the DD guarantee.

ie. British Gas claim for a DD four days early resulting in a charge - the FOS cannot handle the complaint or deal with refund as it is against BG not the Bank.

Oh also that the FOS will still deal with cases of error of charges where the error is on the part of the bank despite the waiver.

i think anyway lol.

[rosymaria]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

Must say I wish you luck with this! The DD guarantee isnt worth the paper its written on!
Have you considered a complaint to the energy ombudsman??

[Amethyst]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

that would probably be the way you would have to take any such claim. Be interesting to try it out.

[argentarius]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

That is an interesting response.

I have consistently advised people in this situation that the company they should pursue for refund of the bank charges is the energy supplier, not the bank, because the bank hasn't made a mistake - the energy supplier has.

But I agree with people who think that this makes the direct debit guarantee a bit of a joke, and it is not unreasonable for people to believe that the DD guarantee implies that they will be indemnified fully against the consequences of any erroneous DDs.

I should also state that it is very, very, rare for any company to take DD payments early. And in quite a few cases where people believe they have been taken early, the original payment advice stated that payment would be taken "on or around" the "due" date which gives the company a little bit of leeway.

A large majority of "the bank took the DD early" complaints relate to cases where the customer failed to fund the account by the close of business, the working day before the DD was taken, which is required by the terms of most banks - the customer typically transferred money in (or paid it over the counter) on the day the DD was due to be taken which was in fact too late.

[TANZARELLI]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

Energywatch first port of call, then if they write to the energy supplier and they give you no joy, go Energy Ombudsman.

[Amethyst]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

On the BACS DD website - Bacs Direct Debit - Did you know?

How do I get back any money paid in error?


If any payment is made in error, you should contact your bank or building society who are responsible for giving you a full and immediate refund - even if the original error was made by the organisation collecting the payment.

Surely that would infer the FOS would have to deal with a complaint where the bank didnt refund the money taken in error ?

[EXC]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

Energywatch first port of call.

The chance would be a fine thing. Energywatch is history.

Watch this: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/video_and_audio/default.stm

[TANZARELLI]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

The chance would be a fine thing. Energywatch is history.

Watch this: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/video_and_audio/default.stm

Yes saw this today on BBC news. This is a nightmare Grrrrrrrrrrrrr.

[Amethyst]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

Ok. So where are consumers to go to now ?

[TANZARELLI]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

Ok. So where are consumers to go to now ?

The EO if no joy with your energy supplier.

energywatch is closing

On 1st October energywatch will merge with Postwatch and the National Consumer Council (including the Scottish and Welsh Consumer Councils) to form Consumer Focus, the new champion for consumers’ interests in England, Scotland, Wales and, for post, Northern Ireland.
In the first instance, any complaints on energy matters should be raised directly with your energy supplier. If you are not satisfied with the response you receive, you may be able to take up your case with the Energy Ombudsman.
To prepare for energywatch closure on 30th September and to allow information from our website to be migrated to the new Consumer Focus website, we have now withdrawn our facility for submitting complaints and enquiries from this website. Up to 30th September, you will still be able to get help from energywatch by contacting our helpline:

• Helpline: 08459 06 07 08
  We offer the RNID Typetalk service for people who are deaf or have speech and hearing impairment: 18001 08459 06 07 08

If you want to submit your enquiry through a website, you will be able to do this from 1st October through Consumer Direct(www.consumerdirect.gov.uk), the Government helpline, who will be able to give you advice and information on how to complain.

http://www.energywatch.org.uk/

http://www.energy-ombudsman.org.uk/

[Amethyst]

Re: FOS and bank charges refund

Energy watch were brilliant. Bummer.