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RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

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  • RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

    Hi,

    I am trying to resolve a PCN ************ received from RCP Parking in July 2017. However, they are not even willing to entertain the appeal.

    Background:
    • Ticket issue date: 10th July 2017
    • Appeal sent by post: 11th July 2017 (stupidly not by recorded delivery)
    • 1st correspondence about unpaid PCN made by TNC Parking Services (debt collection company) on letter dated 29th Sept 2017 (envelope franked and posted 2nd Oct 2017). Received letter 3rd Oct 2017.


    The letter, see attachment, advises that I can appeal to RCP Parking within the following 28 days in writing. This I did on 4th Oct 2017 via RCP Parking's online web form.

    Online web form contents:
    "Dear Sirs,

    RE: PCN Number: 49493 Date of issue: 10/07/2017 Location: Corporation Bridge Street, Sheffield

    I am writing with regards the above matter, as I received a letter from TNC Parking Services, stating that I had an outstanding parking charge (I deliberately use the word charge, as private firms have no legal authority to issue a Penalty Charge Notice, known more commonly as a parking fine).

    1. As the registered keeper, I am writing to advise you that I do not accept liability of this speculative invoice and legally cannot be held responsible for it because I did not receive a conforming Notice To Keeper within the required time. TNC and RCP Parking Limited have therefore failed to issue a properly formatted Notice to Keeper within 56 days and therefore the keeper, I, can NOT be held liable for the charge and they have no court case against me.

    2. As TNC and RCP Parking Limited and have failed to comply with the requirements of POFA to hold me liable for the charge, namely, but not limited to, issuing the Notice to Keeper in excess of the 56 days required and MUST therefore stop writing to me. RCP Parking Limited and TNC must now also remove my details from it’s records and inform me within 21 days that it has been done in accordance to section 10 of the DPA. Please stand notified that continuing to pursue me with this matter is causing distress, ill health and harassment.

    I request that you do either of the following options:

    1. Accept my appeal and remove my details and provide confirmation of that and refrain from sending me further correspondence regarding this matter

    or

    2. Provide me with a POPLA 10 digit verification code for me to progress this appeal with POPLA.
    Please be aware that if a court claim is raised, then I reserve the right to issue a counterclaim for the misuse of my data under the DPA and they should be aware that the minimum sum awarded to me for this would be at least £250.

    I look forward to hearing from you.

    Yours sincerely,


    ********************(Miss)

    Date sent: 4th October 2017

    The response I received is as follows:
    "Dear Mrs **********,

    With regards to this Parking Charge Notice, the time for appeal has run out, you had 28 days to appeal this Parking Charge Notice. We aren’t able to give you a POPLA code because the appeal time is up.

    Also, we are not part of POFA, we do have to keep to the 56 days rule, as we can contact people for up to 3 years.

    “The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA) is a piece of legislation introduced to provide Keeper Liability. This means if the Operator does not know the name and address of the driver they can hold the keeper liable under this legislation. To do this, they will need to meet the requirements contained within POFA. It is not mandatory that an operator uses POFA when issuing a parking charge notice. There is no legal requirement to do so as advised by the parking operator. It is at the discretion of the individual parking company as to whether they choose to utilise use POFA (2012). If no mention of POFA (2012) is made on the parking charge notice the strict timescales as advised in Schedule 4 are not therefore applicable”

    Many thanks,

    BCB"

    Clearly the Notice to Keeper letter was deemed sent 2nd Oct 2017, which is 26 days after the required 56 days from the date of the issuing of the PCN (windscreen Notice to Driver).

    I further followed up the response with an email, see attached file and my original appeal letter, posted 11th July 2017.

    This was their reply to the email dated 18th Oct 2017:

    "Dear Mrs ************,

    PARKING CHARGE NOTICE: 49493
    CAR PARK/DATE/TIME: CORPORATION BRIDGE STREET, 10.07.2017, 12:52
    CAR DETAILS:
    UNAUTHORISED PARKING EVENT: PARKED WITHOUT DISPLAYING A VALID TICKET OR PERMIT

    • Further to your letter received on 19.10.2017 regarding the above detailed parking charge notice.


    • After carefully reading through your letter, I can confirm that we haven’t received any previous communication from your behalf, other than the email dated the 4th October 2017.


    • RCP Parking are not part of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, as this is not stated on our Parking Charge Notices. If we were part of the act we would have to state it on them.


    • The Parking Charge Notice was issued at 12:52 and you purchased your ticket 15:51, which shows that it was over the 15 Minute grace period that we allow people to purchase a ticket.


    • There was a terms and conditions board was where the other signage was for the Mobile Pay and Online payments, which is why we allow a 15 Minute grace period, so people can read the terms and conditions and to purchase the ticket, when people are parking in the car park, they are agreeing to the terms and conditions. As long as we provide at least 1 terms and conditions sign within the car park, we are following the guild lines within the BPA’s Code of Conduct.


    • If you make an online payment or phone payment, the attendants will be notified of the payment.


    • We do not have to provide a POPLA code after 28 days of the Parking Charge Notice.


    Many thanks,
    RCP Parking Ltd
    BCB"

    In my view they have clearly not read my letter fully nor the original appeal letter offering mitigating circumstances. I work for HM Government, so hence one of the mitigating circumstances.

    I have since reviewed the BPA Code of Conduct and it appears RCP Parking have not complied with multiple clauses within the Code.

    How do you think I should pursue this case/appeal from this point?

    Thanks,

    Star
    Last edited by Kati; 21st October 2017, 11:25:AM.
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

    Hi & welcome to LB.

    Firstly, TNC are 3rd party debt collectors & as such, can be safely ignored.

    Was there a windscreen PCN? (Aka Notice to Driver). I would guess there was, but just confirming....
    If so do you still have it?
    Do you have the postal Notice to Keeper?
    Do you have any pictures of site signage?
    Is the vehicle subject to lease or HP?
    CAVEAT LECTOR

    This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

    You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
    Cohen, Herb


    There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
    gets his brain a-going.
    Phelps, C. C.


    "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
    The last words of John Sedgwick

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

      Hi Charitynjw,

      ***** does have the ticket, but on the day of issue, the plastic envelope (which ******** still has) was filled with water, as it hadn't been sealed properly, so the heavy rain that day got in to it and wrecked and it fell apart upon touch it.

      I have both the letter and envelope from TNC (Notice to Keeper) also see attached photo on original post of said letter.

      I have photos of the 2 sign locations, first sign is at the top of entrance gate, does not state it is operated by a ppc, just states "Parking - £1.40 per hour £4.80 all day." Very very small RCP logo.

      T&C Notice only in one place and a sign with instructions for their Mobile Pay app, which was only available from Apple Store, Google Play, Windows Store and Blackberry World. However, the Blackberry World app was no longer available at the time and I had a Blackberry mobile phone.

      The other sign in this group of signs mentioned the all day fee if paid for via the app - £4.80 Online payment - £4.80 (handling fee would also be applied).

      In total across the whole site, these are the only signs. I also have photos of the site empty to demonstrate this.

      The car is on HP.

      - - - Updated - - -

      Also, none of the signs show the BPA & IPC logos as highly recommended in the BPA Code of Practice
      Last edited by Star1179; 20th October 2017, 22:29:PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

        My car is on HP.
        Hire purchase, or Personal Contract Purchase?
        CAVEAT LECTOR

        This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

        You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
        Cohen, Herb


        There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
        gets his brain a-going.
        Phelps, C. C.


        "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
        The last words of John Sedgwick

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

          It is PCP

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

            The original NtK should be from RCP, not the debt collectors.

            Any idea what they mean by
            • The Parking Charge Notice was issued at 12:52 and you purchased your ticket 15:51, which shows that it was over the 15 Minute grace period that we allow people to purchase a ticket.
            It appears they are saying that the driver was parked without a ticket for 3 hrs, then purchased one?
            Last edited by Kati; 21st October 2017, 11:25:AM.
            CAVEAT LECTOR

            This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

            You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
            Cohen, Herb


            There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
            gets his brain a-going.
            Phelps, C. C.


            "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
            The last words of John Sedgwick

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

              ********** paid, or so ********* thought, at about 7.30am on the way into the office. Clearly,********* lost mobile connection as *********** entered building, without noticing, as it had worked the previous few weeks the same way, hence the mitigating circumstances ********* mentioned in the original appeal letter.

              when ********** parked, there was no attendant/RCP employee. So he must have done his "rounds" at 12:52 and isssued my ticket. The 15.51 relates to me leaving my office building and regaining the mobile signal and completing the payment which ******** thought had been completed at around 7.30am.

              Staff aren't really allowed to use mobiles in the offer due to security reasons (HM Government employee), plus ********* had only started their job there a few weeks before, so being more cautious regarding mobile phone rules.
              Last edited by Star1179; 20th October 2017, 22:27:PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

                'The driver' paid.....into 'the' office....etc etc.

                The parking co can circumvent PoFA & hold the driver liable if they can ID them.
                CAVEAT LECTOR

                This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

                You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
                Cohen, Herb


                There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
                gets his brain a-going.
                Phelps, C. C.


                "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
                The last words of John Sedgwick

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

                  I haven't identified ********* ******** as the driver. As far as they know ***************** passenger and offered to pay the paying fee. As there was no attendant when *************** returned to the vehicle at 15.55 approx.
                  Last edited by Star1179; 20th October 2017, 21:49:PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

                    Parking cos are known to trawl the internet fora.
                    Best to edit posts if & where necessary.
                    CAVEAT LECTOR

                    This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

                    You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
                    Cohen, Herb


                    There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
                    gets his brain a-going.
                    Phelps, C. C.


                    "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
                    The last words of John Sedgwick

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

                      What do you recommend ********** do in regards the ticket?
                      Last edited by Star1179; 20th October 2017, 21:52:PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

                        Good question.

                        So far this year, according to BMPA, RCP have not 'done' court at all.
                        & only once in 2016.
                        http://www.bmpa.eu/companydata/RCP_Parking.html

                        We would need to see the original Notice to Keeper* (from RCP, not the debt collector), plus the original windscreen PCN*, & pics of the relevant site signs, to give an opinion.

                        *Obscure personal/identifying info but leave all times & dates visible.
                        CAVEAT LECTOR

                        This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

                        You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
                        Cohen, Herb


                        There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
                        gets his brain a-going.
                        Phelps, C. C.


                        "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
                        The last words of John Sedgwick

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

                          Here are the photos of the signs and the rest of the car park when empty
                          Attached Files

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

                            Those signs are nowhere near compliant.
                            CAVEAT LECTOR

                            This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

                            You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
                            Cohen, Herb


                            There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
                            gets his brain a-going.
                            Phelps, C. C.


                            "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
                            The last words of John Sedgwick

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: RCP Parking PCN - Refused appeal

                              The company seems to believe they are. From the BPA Code of Practice, I have identified about 20 breaches the company has committed

                              Comment

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