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Thread: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

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  1. #1
    Cubsfan's Avatar

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    Default Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    I have joined a long list of small businesses that appear to have been scammed by Patient Direct/ Multimedia International. The price was misquoted, I naively believed he was telling the truth! So it is about three times what I agreed with the Salesman, the adverts are smaller than agreed as much of the screen is taken up with banners and the promised 5 to 10 minute repeat cycle is not correct. They are insisting that their contract allows them to do all these things. They are threatening to sue me for Tort if I post factual warnings about their antics.

    The NHS whose surgeries the ads are in are trying to distance themselves from any involvement claiming to receive anything from zero to £150pa to host the ads in a surgery.

    I am not a llimited company.
    Any advice or anyone like to contact me to compare experiences I would love to hear from you.

  2. #2
    ostell's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Have a search in this forum for the many threads about this lot.

  3. #3
    Cubsfan's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Thanks, I noticed some from 2014, I will look for some newer ones as well.

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    ostell's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.


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    Amethyst's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Do you have pictures/ video of the screens displaying the adverts ?
    “We may not win by protesting, but if we don’t protest we will lose. If we stand up to them, there is always a chance we will win.” Hetty Bower

    Any advice I provide is given without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

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  6. #6
    Cubsfan's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    I am going to the surgeries this week to find details of the other advertisers and will take some photos then.
    Last edited by Amethyst; 13th August 2017 at 09:11:AM. Reason: Word change

  7. #7
    Amethyst's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Good. You could make a factual post showing the actual advertising received under the terms of the contract.

    The surgeries who have hire of the screens have no responsibility for the adverts shown, although they are able to select types of adverts that they do not wish to be shown ( e.g. Gambling etc) I believe they can select which health presentations are shown. I'm not sure if the PD screens integrate with the appointments calling system.

    Also not sure if they pay for the screens or if they are simply provided on condition the advertising is displayed ( so screens are in essence sponsored by advertisers via PD)

    If you find a forum for practice managers there's a few posts about these screens on there from the NHS perspective.
    “We may not win by protesting, but if we don’t protest we will lose. If we stand up to them, there is always a chance we will win.” Hetty Bower

    Any advice I provide is given without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

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  8. #8
    Cubsfan's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amethyst View Post
    Good. You could make a factual post showing the actual advertising received under the terms of the contract.

    The surgeries who have hire of the screens have no responsibility for the adverts shown, although they are able to select types of adverts that they do not wish to be shown ( e.g. Gambling etc) I believe they can select which health presentations are shown. I'm not sure if the PD screens integrate with the appointments calling system.

    Also not sure if they pay for the screens or if they are simply provided on condition the advertising is displayed ( so screens are in essence sponsored by advertisers via PD)

    If you find a forum for practice managers there's a few posts about these screens on there from the NHS perspective.
    The screens run predominantly adverts, medical information was confined to clinic times of operation so Alpert from 5% fee they don't seem to get a great deal out of it although as they do receive an income from them I have suggested to them that they have some responsibility to ensure advertisers get what they pay for and that as health care providers they should not be associated with a company whose behaviour contributes to the ill health through stress of the advertisers.

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    Lola49's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    I've just posted a new thread about my experience with this mob. Are you paying them? Have a look at my post on here. I also feel ripped off by them, but I think there is something in the law that is about 'fitness for purpose' this means (any other posters correct me if I'm wrong) that something sold has to fit the purpose its sold for. I have frankly had enough of them, I think they operate just within the law, not sure how they are anything to do with NHS but certainly won't help the NHS reputation!

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    EXC's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lola49 View Post
    I've just posted a new thread about my experience with this mob. Are you paying them? Have a look at my post on here.
    So that people can find it, it's here http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...459#post746459

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  11. #11
    Cubsfan's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Hi Lola, I had the same thing with the fee issue, they didn't mention VAT or the final cost. They have now admitted that I was told the wrong number of DDs claiming it was human error but it was because he was pretending it was a 12 month contract. It doesn't seem much I can do about the fees as I believed what I was told rather than what was written. However the ad size is not what I was told because the banners on the side and bottom of the screen where not on the example I was shown when I signed or when the artwork was sent for approval. I was told that the ad would be shown every 5-10 mins but is actually shown, when the TVs work, every 35 mins. I have told them I am not paying anymore because I did not get what I signed up for. They have offered to double the rate of display but that's still not as often as agreed. They have also offered to curtail the contract after a year but continue showing it for another year if I pay for one year. I have told them as I only got 2/3 of the screen size displayed at best 1/3 of the time I only got 2/9ths of what I paid for so have asked for a refund of the 7/9ths less 1 artwork.
    I have reported them to Action Fraud. NHS England were useless so I have reported the
    to NHS fraud protect. I have contacted other advertisers to remind them they need to cancel with 6 months to go. I have contacted the GP Practice mangers to tell them that this is not good for my health and I know one of them has contacted Patient Direct about this. A google search of them comes up with a practice manger review of them and both of those are scathing. If I don't get my refund I will be reporting this to the Office of Fair trading.

  12. #12
    Lola49's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    I expect there are loads of people they've scammed, they seem to target small businesses because we are busy and don't always have the infrastructure that big businesses have. It sounds like you've lost faith in them and frankly who wouldn't!
    I haven't yet reported them but will do, am looking at the most relevant agencies so thanks for the suggestions, will follow them up.
    I am not paying them either but they've now sent me a nasty letter threatening legal action, I'm furious and won't be giving them any more money! I have asked them for a refund too.
    The ads in the surgery can't really be good for them either - to be affiliated with such an awful set of people! Keep posting & let me know what happens.

  13. #13
    Cubsfan's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    I have been posting warnings on social media to protect others and to find other victims and get them to contact watchdog if enough contact them they may do a feature I haven't heard back from Action Fraud and NHS Protect yet but the more who contact them and the actual practices the better

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    des8's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    As you haven't received what you paid for, and consider the product was misrepresented have you considered using the Misrepresentation Act 1967 and rescinding the contract?

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Thanks I will look into that

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Can you use that when its business to business? I thought that might be just for consumers and didn't protect business to business dealings?

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    Lola49's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Can you use that when its business to business? I thought that might be just for consumers and didn't protect business to business dealings?

    Found the relevant legal protection:
    The*Sale of Goods Act 1979*and the*Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982*have not been repealed and still apply to contracts for the sale of goods and the supply of services outside a consumer context (eg private sales and business to business transactions).**The main protection offered covers*where the seller does not have the right to sell the goods,*where the goods are sold by description there is an implied term that the*goods will correspond to that description, businesses must ensure that the goods they sell are of satisfactory quality and fit*for their purpose, where the goods are sold by sample there is an implied term that*the goods will correspond to the sample in quality.*In addition there are implied terms that the service must be carried out with reasonable care*and skill,*that the service will be carried out within a reasonable time*and where no price is agreed a reasonable price will be paid.*These protections are in the form of statutory implied terms. This means that the*Consumer Rights Actor the*Sale of Goods Act*will put these terms into all contracts for the sale of goods no matter what the parties themselves have agreed in the terms and conditions of sale.

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    des8's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Claims for misrepresentation are governed by both the common law and the Misrepresentation Act 1967 (MA 1967) and are applicable to all contracts (B2B or C2B)
    The false statement may be made innocently, negligently or fraudulently.
    An actionable misrepresentation entitles the innocent party to rescind the contract unless the court determines otherwise, though it may award damages in lieu of rescission. Damages are also available where the misrepresentation has caused the innocent party loss.

  19. #19
    Cubsfan's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Thank you, that's very helpful

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    EXC's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Just throwing this out there but there are some regulations ''The Business Protection from Misleading Marketing Regulations 2008'' that may be relevant.

    See Page 4 Paragraph 3 (2) (a) and beyond.

    3 Prohibition of advertising which misleads traders

    (1) Advertising which is misleading is prohibited.

    (2) Advertising is misleading which

    (a) in any way, including its presentation, deceives or is likely to deceive the traders to whom it is ad-dressed or whom it reaches; and by reason of its deceptive nature, is likely to affect their economic behaviour...
    The question is whether 'presentation' includes what you are told in sales patter.
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  21. #21
    Peridot's Avatar

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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    As an aside, I know of other advertising type arrangements on these screen, where although the ad was fine, it was discovered that the screen was rarely even switched on! Very difficult to monitor this other than sitting in the waiting room all day. Do check what obligations the surgery or other place with the screen has to leave it switched on and cycling the ads.
    I am a qualified solicitor employed by the LegalBeagles forum to provide guidance on a wide range of legal queries. I am happy to try and assist informally, where needed.

    Any posts I make on LegalBeagles are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as legal advice. Any practical advice I give is without liability. I do not represent people on the forum.

    If in doubt you should always seek professional face to face legal advice.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    Yes Peridot this is my exact experience. It is hard to monitor but evety time I've gone into the surgery the screen is not on ( bar one time).
    Also if you've had no business from it this is an indication that its not doing what the seller told me it would.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Patient Direct, misselling of advertising.

    The surgery reckon it's all controlled from Patient Direct, that the TVs are on timers and that they only get 5% of the advert revenue

    - - - Updated - - -

    I have had no business from it in four months

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