Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

[James118118]

Hi there

I wonder if you could help, four years ago my wife and I had a very serious accident, I was left partially injured but made a full recovery, my wife however broke her back and has been unable to work ever since. At the time of the accident we didn’t have holiday insurance and were stuck abroad for 6 weeks whilst my wife had numerous surgeries to fix her back, when we returned to England I was still unable to work for a further month whilst my wife made it back to some semblance of normality with her motor functions

My work only covered 2 days sick pay for the duration and you can imagine the cost’s racked up, we have three children a dog and a mother in law all in tow. The end result we maxed out two credit cards to the tune of £11,500

I explained the situation to the banks and they agreed a repayment plan for me, each card was taking £180 a month from me, £169 interest and £11 capital after some time I simply couldn’t keep up, I called the banks and explained the situation, MBNA offered me a settlement figure of around £1,800-£2,000 to clear a debt of £4,100 which was a great offer however I simply couldn’t raise anything close to that figure, we were then in the process of moving to a much smaller house, as mentioned my wife couldn’t work etc etc

On my credit file it states the loans defaulted to Arrow LTD on 07/2011 but I think I stopped paying way before then, if memory serves me correctly is was around 3 years ago or more

Moving on to last week I received a county court summons to Northampton county court to pay the amount of £5,432.05 claim amount, £190 court fee, £100 solicitors fee total amount £5,722.05

My finances today are pretty poor, I had to leave my job which was paying around £35,000 a year at the time to a lesser role that supposedly gave me more time at home to help with my wife’s issues and the children, that took my salary down to £28,000. This summer I resigned as I was working longer hours than I have ever before and just couldn’t stay afloat, I have opted to become self employed and have started working as a workman, I’m training at the moment and earn around £70-£100 a week, I have benefits in the form of working tax credits and housing benefit but spare cash is a rare thing

My wife has become a at home student and her course is costing us just under £300 a month, the idea being she trains in something she can do from home, as things stand we are just getting by really but we both want to try this way with a view to a better life a few years down the line when my wife graduates and I learn which end of a paint brush to use

Any help or advice you could offer I would appreciate greatly, I saw you have forward a response on to another person that is having a similar issue with Arrow, it stated she issues a CPR 31.14 Request is this something I should do as well?

So far I have logged on to money claim online and completed the AOS and that’s it

All the best

[mystery1]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Have they issued a claim or sent a letter saying they will ?

A 31.14 request is for court claims.

A s78 request is what you should send.

M1

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Moving on to last week I received a county court summons to Northampton county court to pay the amount of £5,432.05 claim amount, £190 court fee, £100 solicitors fee total amount £5,722.05

My finances today are pretty poor, I had to leave my job which was paying around £35,000 a year at the time to a lesser role that supposedly gave me more time at home to help with my wife’s issues and the children, that took my salary down to £28,000. This summer I resigned as I was working longer hours than I have ever before and just couldn’t stay afloat, I have opted to become self employed and have started working as a workman, I’m training at the moment and earn around £70-£100 a week, I have benefits in the form of working tax credits and housing benefit but spare cash is a rare thing

My wife has become a at home student and her course is costing us just under £300 a month, the idea being she trains in something she can do from home, as things stand we are just getting by really but we both want to try this way with a view to a better life a few years down the line when my wife graduates and I learn which end of a paint brush to use

Any help or advice you could offer I would appreciate greatly, I saw you have forward a response on to another person that is having a similar issue with Arrow, it stated she issues a CPR 31.14 Request is this something I should do as well?

So far I have logged on to money claim online and completed the AOS and that’s it

All the best

You have 14 days to acknowledge the claim (from date of service, whenever that was last week). I assume you stated your intention to defend in full, if so, you'd have a further 14 days (28 in total) to submit your defence.

Yes, you need to send a CPR 31.14 request for documents mentioned on the particulars of claim. The one below is fairly generic, you may need to amend it to suit. It should be sent recorded delivery to the solicitors acting for the claimant (who are they using, Restons? :noidea

Dear Sirs,

Re: XXXX v YYYYY
Case No: xxxx

CPR 31.14 Request

On [DATE] I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the Northampton County Court.

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest your entire claim.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of each of the following documents mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

1. The Agreement. Together with the relevant terms associated with that account, you will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.
2. The notice of assignment.
3. The default notice, compliant with 87(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

Although your claim is for a sum which does not exceed £10,000.00 and thus in all likelihood it will be allocated to the small claims track once I deliver my defence, however as I am unable to lodge my defence at this moment, the case has not been allocated to a track for determination upon delivering a defence, as a consequence the provisions of CPR 27(2) have no effect and you should not seek to avoid compliance with your CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise.

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the documents I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing as a result to a modification, obliteration or other marking, or feature, each version thus will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any, and all version(s) and include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) that are now in the possession of a third party.

In accordance with CPR 31.15(c) I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

Yours faithfully

---

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Have they issued a claim or sent a letter saying they will ?

Looks like they have and the OP has acknowledged it.

So far I have logged on to money claim online and completed the AOS and that’s it

A 31.14 request is for court claims.

A s78 request is what you should send.

Below is a s.78 letter for reference, which should be sent recorded delivery to Arrow a.s.a.p. with a postal order for £1 and signed using a computer font rather than your real signature.

They have 14 days to respond. :thumb:

Dear Sirs,

Account or Reference No.:

I hereby formally request a copy of my Consumer Credit Agreement, pursuant to s.77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (CCA1974).I require you to provide me with a true copy, or reconstituted copy of the credit agreement relating to any account you deem to be mine, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide. I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit (12 + 2 days).

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties. Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b), 6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).

In line with recent OFT Guidance (issued Oct 2010) surrounding Unenforceability, I presume you're aware that the OFT has stipulated that 'sections 77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 outline the information creditors must provide to debtors under fixed-term, running account & Hire Agreements'. This simply means that under these sections a debtor can pay £1 to get:

• a copy of their agreement
• copies of some of the other documents mentioned in their agreement
• a statement of account

If this information is not provided within 12 working days the debt becomes unenforceable. This means a creditor cannot:

• make the debtor pay the debt before they're supposed to
• get a court judgment against the debtor

So, in line with the OFT Guidance, and the Consumer Credit Act, please find attached my £1 payment, which is the statutory fee - note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose.

Yours faithfully,

[James118118]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Wow, thankyou very much for all of the above, you are correct that at present I have simply completed the AOS, so my next step is to select "defend in full" and submit the s.78 letter you have kindly provided? should I in addition send the CPR 31.14 request or is this not necessary?

Thankyou once again for your support

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Wow, thankyou very much for all of the above, you are correct that at present I have simply completed the AOS, so my next step is to select "defend in full"
and submit the s.78 letter you have kindly provided?

When you did the AoS you should have ticked the 'defend in full' box, didn't you do so?

That should have given you a total of 28 days from date of service to put together a defence. I notice it's been 3 weeks since my posts above.

Have you not sent the s78 CCA request?

should I in addition send the CPR 31.14 request or is this not necessary?

Yes, that should also ideally have been sent before Christmas... :santa1:

[James118118]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Hi there

When I completed the AOS I didn't do anything else at all

Today have opted to defend in full and have stated that I will be sending the S.78 request through

I will add in the CPR 31.14 request as confirmed, thankyou

Around the SA78 CCA request I'm not sure what that is, sorry, my understanding of legal forms is very limited, I just Googled it and came up with an airways company

[Amethyst]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Have you just entered your defence via the MoneyClaim Online service ( https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/web/mcol/welcome ) ?

If you have can you still see a copy and can you paste in here what you put.

So your defence is due around about now, you haven't yet sent a CPR letter to the claimants, nor have you sent a section 78 request for a copy of your credit agreement to the claimants/original creditors.

Just making sure we're all on the same page with this.

Other than the banks being less than helpful following your change in circumstances do you have a dispute of the debt ?

[James118118]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

yes that's correct, I have entered my defence on money claim online

I simply stated the following

"Good Morning

I intend to defend all of this claim, I have today submitted the
s.78 letter to

Arrow Global Guernsey Limited R/O 20-22 Bedford Row London WC1R
4JS sent recorded delivery and including the £1 standard charge
via postal order

In addition I have sent another copy to Blake Lapthorn Harbour
Court Compass Road North Harbour Portsmouth Hampshire PO6 4ST, to
keep on file for the records

Yours sincerely"

If the above is incorrect and you think I should submit something else please feel free to educate me, I'm sure there must be some way to edit my response

You are correct that I haven't submitted either form as yet, they are both printed and sitting in an envelope ready, I am popping to pick the children up in 1 hour and had planned to send them both then

Around the dispute of the debt really the main thing is that it is grossly exaggerated, MBNA offered me the settlement of £1800-£2000 which I couldn't afford then and I can't afford now, Arrow have increased it to £5722

The main point for me is I can't pay this bill and won't be able to for the foreseeable future, I know that's no kind of defence but that's unfortunately where I'm at, as we speak we are prepping for a long awaited hospital appointment for my wife tomorrow, she is having further back surgery to remove said pins and plates with a view to possibly moving her condition forward. As mentioned before we have 3 children and I'm self employed so work is going to bit a little tricky over the next few weeks. Again as mentioned above there hasn't been any work for me since before Christmas due to the weather

I'm not looking for a sad song or anything, I'm just trying to outline why I really can't afford this bill

[Amethyst]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

I thought that's what you might have done. I really don't know if there is a way to edit it, as it stands the claimants will simply ask for your defence to be struck out and the court will just do it, so we need to amend it... for right now though send the letters to the claimants (the CCA request and the section 78) regardless while you pick up the children and I'll have a look through the rest of your thread.

[Amethyst]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Right.

To me it sounds as though you don't dispute the debt, and have just had such a huge change in your circumstances that you could no longer afford to repay it and the banks didn't help enough with enabling you to make affordable payments.

Do you want to go through the process of getting copies of documents from the creditors to see if there are any technicalities you could possibly use to defend the debt, the debt isn't statute barred.... I'm not sure when you took out the credit cards though, if they are really really old ( 2000 odd) then you may have a chance they don't have the Credit Agreement which would barr them from enforcing the debt .................

.................or would you rather sort it out now by making an offer to pay of an affordable monthly payment which would be set by the court. You would have a CCJ against you, which I think you are not that fussed about, and you don't own your home so that is not at risk. The CCJ would stay on your credit file for 6 years. If so then you need to get that defence withdrawn (having it struck out may incur more costs and might well deny you the opportunity to have an installment order straight away from the court leaving you further costs in applying to have the judgment redetermined to installments later ) and submit an admission and an offer to pay , along with a detailed income and expenditure form showing how much you could reasonably afford to pay.

Don't worry about not understanding the court processes, some of us here are a little too used to the system and forget others aren't quite so used to dealing with these kind of claims, my apologies for that.

I think you have more important things to be worrying about at the moment and want to be looking after your wife and the children rather than getting into protracted arguments with annoying creditors who don't care.

[James118118]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Hi there

thank you for your responses, I would be really stuck without your advice

I've just called Money claim online and they have stated I can add to my defence, I can email over any amendments and they will add it in within 24 hours

Around the best course of action I would like to defend the claim, the card is quite old, according to the details on my exquifax account I opened the account on 12/05/2008 and it went to default on 30/07/2011

[Amethyst]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Okay, that you opened the account late 2008 means a) they are very likely to have the right documents b) they are likely to be compliant and c) they are able to reconstruct the documents anyway.

However, there's always the chance they won't....so I think if that is the way you want to go, waiting for the responses to your CPR letter and CCA letter then we need to amend your defence to a basic holding defence (I know they aren't recommended but we have to amend/add to the defence to something as we are late sending the CPR and CCA requests and can't get agreement for an extension at this time).

I'd like others input on this too if you want to try and defend as to the best route to take defence wise so lets look over it this evening so you will be able to email the courts later on so they can do the amendments tomorrow.

[James118118]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Really I can't thank you enough for all your help, I look forward to seeing what your collective legal talent has come with

[James118118]

Re: Can anyone Help with a debt passed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited via MBNA?

Hi there

hope your well, I was just wondering if you had any further thoughts?

I am going to send over a revised defence today

All the best