Hi - really need some help!

[violet blush]

Hi, I bought a tractor, just a small one back in February, It wasn't delivered until March and it went wrong about 2 weeks later. The guy who sold it came out and fixed something on the clutch that was stopping it from moving forward. Ten minutes after he left it did it again. These tractors are sold as "the small holders friend" and are "simple, easy to maintain with the manual' kind of kit.

Not quite true. The manual doesn't help at all, is in badly translated Chinese and offers no part names etc. And realistically you need a lot of tools including a crane which your average small holder just doesn't have. Two weeks later bloke still not coming back out as more interested in selling to more people at county shows than looking after what he has already sold and the tractor has spent more time in the barn trying to get it to move than it has been out in the field (only has 10 hours on the clock) Then it stopped moving any of the gear that goes on the PTO and the PTO is no longer working.

He tells me I can split the tractor myself with the help of the manual. I can replace the parts. I then phone the manufacturer, speak to someone and she tells me she has done it on her first tractor (turns out its ex wife and they used to build them together - You Tube video's to prove - so another liar in the mix) - so my husband takes it to our local engineer - who laughs and says he can fix it - he orders parts from the bloke who sold it to us - 5 weeks ago - still the parts have not arrived, variety of reasons (like he is selling more tractors at more County Shows) still I have no tractor, 12 acres of winter feed is lost as we have nothing to cut it.

He will try to argue that we broke the PTO as we didn't know how to use it - we did - the base line is the PTO is connected to the clutch system and a faulty clutch will break the PTO. He also added the clutch on one of them will break in 20 minutes - on a tractor!!??!!

He is lying to us left right and centre about the parts being on a plane from China - and I have absolutely no faith in either him, the parts ever arriving or the machinery ever working properly. He has a reputation (we have now discovered) for using old parts from a warehouse fire in new tractors - can't say this is one but its not looking hopeful)

Can I do anything to get a refund? Can I take him to court, if so how? What legislation do I rely on?

Can you please help - very hungry sheep over winter if I can't get this sorted......

[Setmefree3]

Did you buy this tractor online, with the terms parts only covered? How long was the warrenty for .

[violet blush]

Hi, no, didn't buy it on line but from a dealer near here. The warranty is only a parts warranty so if a part goes you send to them. and they decide if its covered, broken etc.

[Setmefree3]

Someone with more experience will hopefully help you.

[des8]

Tell your local engineer to stop working on the "tractor".
How did you pay for the item... cash/credit card/finance?

You have certain rights under the Consumer Rights Act 2015 (CRA 2015) which enable you to reject goods under certain circumstances.
How you reject the item will depend on how it was purchased.

[violet blush]

I paid cash - £12k. I thought I could only reject before 14 days of taking delivery was up.

[des8]

So you can sue for return of your money.
However this does come at an initial cost.
For a claim of £12000 the issuing fee will be £540, and if it proceeds to a hearing a further £545 (fast track) or £335 (small claims track).
On winning these costs are recoverable from the defendant.
You may be entitled to fee remission if on a low income (https://www.gov.uk/government/public...-tribunal-fees)
As the claim will be in excess of £10,000 it will probably be allocated to the fast track, which has cost implications.
Claims under £10000 are generally allocated to small claims track, where costs which can be recouped from the losing side are very limited.
It is possible however that as the claim will be relatively simple the court will allocate it to the small claims track on application

Basically you start your claim by writing to the seller (ltd company or sole trader?).
You set out details of your purchase (what, when, how much) and detail when delivery taken.
Remind him of its initial failure, and your agreement that he repair it.
Remind him of its subsequent failure and his failure to repair.

Then refer him to CRA 2015, which implies to every contract that the goods must be of satisfactory quality and fit for purpose.
This tractor was neither.
He was given the opportunity to repair (which was not necessary) but which he failed to do.
The tractor was in use for less than thirty days from the date of delivery (the time spent being repaired does not count) and so you are execrcising your right to reject the item.
You require a full refund as per your rights under CRA 2015, and for him to arrange collection of the tractor at his cost.

Failure to respond within 14 days and you will initiate court action without further reference to him.

Don't issue court threat unless you intend to carry it through
Do you think he will be able to make the repayment? not worth suing if he's broke!

[violet blush]

He's sold 42 tractors over the summer according to his face book profile.... so would hope not broke.

The time line is like this.

We bought the tractor on the 18th Feb.
He delivered it on 12th March. It couldn't be used immediately as the harrow didn't arrive for another month.
The snows came in for two weeks after that. We have wet clay ground - so no use.
25th of April I asked him to come and fix it as it wasn't working. (I had I think prior to this let him know but no offer to come out was made until the 25th and that was only after I contacted the main company and they contacted him)
26th of April he came and "fixed" it.
My other half took it into the field, got off to open the gate, when he got back in it, it wouldn't move again on starting (April 26th)
Let him know April 29th still not working - he told me I could fix it myself with the manual - but he hadn't given us a manual.
4th of May manual arrived, we tried again and 6th of May I was trying to fix it in the field again with him telling me how via message. Gave up.
26th May went up to the engineers.

Does that make a difference? In reality the tractor was never going to get more than 40 hours use a year if it worked properly.

[des8]

That clarifies matters.
Basically the order was not completed until delivered ie about 12th April.
You notified him of the problems 25th April and requested he put the tractor into a satisfactory condition.
He has failed to do this so your short term right to reject within the first 30 days following delivery remains.

You might have to prove the fault was present at the time of purchase, so a chat with your engineer to see if he would confirm this could be useful.

[davenewbergr]

You have certain rights under the Consumer Rights Act 2015 (CRA 2015) which enable you to reject goods under certain circumstances.

Probably not, since it seems clear that it was purchased in the course of a business ('smallholding', 'hungry sheep').

[davenewbergr]

your short term right to reject within the first 30 days following delivery remains.

Again, this seems to have been a commercial acquisition rather than a consumer purchase.

[davenewbergr]

I hate to get involved in a disagreement so soon after I joined the forums but I think DES8 may be on the wrong track. The Consumer Rights Act deals with any contract for the supply of goods or services where the seller is in business and the purchaser is a consumer: "an individual acting for purposes that are wholly or mainly outside that individual's trade, business, craft or profession".

OP's remedy is a simple breach of contract claim. The provisions of the consumer legislation are a good guide to the terms that will probably be implied by the court - following the claimant's submissions - that the goods (tractor) must be fit for purpose and free from defects, but in England & Wales there is no specific legislation governing general contract law.

The first step is to negotiate with the other side. I see that you have at least partially carried out that step. But it is important that it be done in writing, as you may wish to be able to prove who said what to the court at a later date. So if you do not already have an email trail showing that, then sit down and write an email (or letter) summarising AS BRIEFLY AS HUMANLY POSSIBLE the conversations that you have had up to now. Invite him to confirm the accuracy of your summary. (Either he does so, or he says some bits are incorrect, or he doesn't reply. All of these are potentially helpful to you.)

The you must give him an ultimatum: 'this is a commercial operation and every day that we are without a usable tractor is a problem, and also an expense. You must arrange to replace this tractor with a fully serviceable one within 14 days. If we have not heard from you by then, we will issue proceedings to recover the purchase price to enable us to acquire a tractor from another source'. (That's just an example.)

If - and in fact, before - you decide to make a claim against the dealer, go here and download the Handbook for Litigants in person. If, after reading those parts that apply to you, you do not have full confidence that you have the smarts, the dedication, the motivation and the time to do it yourself, then contact a law firm local to you that has a litigation department and ask for an initial consultation. You'll find out more about what is going on, the state of the evidence, and the costs of continuing with proceedings.

One tip: make sure you know who you are dealing with. If you have a receipt, or an invoice, or you have made a payment to a specific payee, then make sure that is the party named in your claim. If he is a sole trader, then you claim against him. If he is in a partnership, you claim against the partnership. If it is a limited company, you claim against the company. A lot of people - even lawyers - get caught out with this.

[des8]

Thanks for pointing that out. I've always considered a smallholding more of a (paying?) hobby than a business.

As a business one would be looking at the Sale of Goods Act 1979 for protection.
A term is implied by that Act into any contract that goods will be of satisfactory quality and fit for purpose
If the contract is breached the main remedies are to reject the goods outright and claim a full refund (plus damages) or to claim damages for the cost of repair.
The limitations Act applies

So if you are a business, and are intent on initiating a court claim your letter should be on the lines of:

You set out details of your purchase (what, when, how much) and detail when delivery taken.
Remind him of its initial failure, and your agreement that he repair it.
Remind him of its subsequent failure and his failure to repair, or to supply the parts to enable it to be repaired

Then refer him to Sale of Goods Act 1979, which implies to every contract that the goods must be of satisfactory quality and fit for purpose.
This tractor was neither.

You require a full refund and for him to arrange collection of the tractor at his cost.

Failure to respond within 14 days and you will initiate court action without further reference to him.

Now read post 12, and pleased to be corrected! (i'm slow at typing and often get over taken)

[violet blush]

Hi, thanks all! IM NOT THOUGH A BUSINESS!! OR A COMPANY - I bought it for me as a consumer. I have 12 acres of land and a few sheep on it to keep the grass in check. I don't breed the sheep or slaughter - they are nothing more than lawn mowers..... It wasn't a transaction made between businesses it was his LTD company and me as a consumer ... not a farmer. So surely me buying this tractor to make my life easier after I broke my back is no different to buying a microwave?

[des8]

Glad to see my original feelings about small holding were probably correct ...a hobby

So revert to referring to CRA 2015, and send to the Ltd Company.