Help! Need some urgent advice regarding a redetermination hearing

[blakey1152]

Good Morning,
Hope someone can offer me some advice. Basically my former landlord has taken me to court without my knowledge and obtained a CCJ against me. Although this CCJ doesn't appear on my credit file at either my old or new address.

He has applied for an attachment of earnings order. The first I knew about this was when I got a letter in the post saying that I hadn't filled in form N56 and returned it within the timescale and that now this form would be served upon me using a bailiff.
I never got the original N56 form anyway so I didn't do anything just waited for a bailiff to show up and give me a form as that's what the letter said would happen.

However, not to worry, because no bailiff ever turned up - instead the ex-landlord has gone straight to my employer and I get an attachment of earnings order for a value that is way too high for me to afford.
I spoke to citizens advice who told me that I can write a letter to the court and explain what has happened and that the amount is too high and request a redetermination hearing.
This I did. and three weeks later I got a letter from a county court about 50 miles from me saying that upon defendant request for determination it is ordered that pursuant to CPR 23.3(2)(b) this letter is deemed to be an application for review and will be listed for hearing.

I got a letter this morning from my ex-landlords solicitor which says two things that I want to check actually are correct.
Firstly, they are asking for a copy of the letter that I sent to the court as apparently I am obliged to send this to his solicitors this as well - The Citizens advice only told me that I had to write to the court. So is this true?

And secondly, as they say as its a hearing they will request that I pay the costs of their solicitors for attending the hearing.
Again, Surely because I've asked for redetermination they can't ask for even more costs to be added to it?

Please help. as if they take the order out on my next pay day I won't be able to pay my essential bills such as council tax and utilities and i'm worried sick

Thankyou in advance
B

[jaguarsuk]

Firstly, they are asking for a copy of the letter that I sent to the court as apparently I am obliged to send this to his solicitors this as well - The Citizens advice only told me that I had to write to the court. So is this true?

And secondly, as they say as its a hearing they will request that I pay the costs of their solicitors for attending the hearing.
Again, Surely because I've asked for redetermination they can't ask for even more costs to be added to it?

Please help. as if they take the order out on my next pay day I won't be able to pay my essential bills such as council tax and utilities and i'm worried sick

Thankyou in advance
B

In answer to your specific questions:

No you don't have to send them a copy of the letter as it is not a document requiring service. They have been served by the court and they will duly be served a hearing notice.

Yes they can as the first judgement was determined due to you not returning the N56, now you have requested a further hearing. Requesting doesn't mean they will though.

You'd be wise to complete one to serve on the court and solicitors now: https://assets.publishing.service.go...98/n56-eng.pdf

Now for mine:

Do you dispute the amount the landlord has claimed?

Did you receive the claim form?

If you did not do you know where they sent it?

If you had received it would you have defended the claim?

What is the claim for?

[blakey1152]

Evening!

to answer your questions.
firstly, I do dispute the amount that is claimed simply because I never got a claim form in the first place so I don’t know what all of it is for.

i didn’t receive the original court claim form so I can only assume that it was sent to my old address which he knew that I had moved out of!

[blakey1152]

It posted that before I had finished it!

i am 100 percent sure it’s for unpaid rent that was disputed because the landlord wanted more rent that he actually asked for originally and he didn’t do any repairs so I had to pay to get the kitchen ceiling removed because it had collapsed and all the plumbing in the bathroom redone because of leaks. This and many other things!

So yes I would have part defended what he says that I owe

unfortunately because I never received a copy of the judgment in the first instance I don’t know how much the court had ordered me to pay either

B

[jaguarsuk]

Okay, varying the attachment of earning order is not your best course of action.

You should seek to set the judgement aside under CPR 13.2 in that you did not receive the claim form. The cost of an application is £255 or £100 if the claimant consents (I doubt they would), but if successful you can ask the court make the claimant pay you this back as they knew your new address and serving it on a previous address is abuse of process amounting to unreasonable conduct under CPR 27.14.

If set aside you will have the opportunity to defend the claim, therefore you should contact the court and ask for copies of the claim form along with the judgement as these will bear the address they were sent.

Once you have the copies you should write to the solicitor to inform them of your intention and asking them to agree to set aside within 7 calendar days or else you'll apply to the court. If after 7 days they don't reply or refuse then you file form N244 to request the judgement set aside.

[blakey1152]

Afternoon,
i just want to make 100 percent sure I do this correct
so I ask for a copy of the claim form and judgment from the court first then write to the solicitors and tell them what
i intend to get the judgment set aside and after that if they
refuse or don’t reply then fill in the N244 form

i read it a few times and wasn’t sure if I had to apply for the N244 first
thankyou so much for all your help
B

[jaguarsuk]

Afternoon,
i just want to make 100 percent sure I do this correct
so I ask for a copy of the claim form and judgment from the court first then write to the solicitors and tell them what
i intend to get the judgment set aside and after that if they
refuse or don’t reply then fill in the N244 form

i read it a few times and wasn’t sure if I had to apply for the N244 first
thankyou so much for all your help
B

Yes that's correct. There's more info on set aside here: http://legalbeagles.info/forums/foru...tailed-version

[blakey1152]

Here’s an update . I contacted the county court and asked for a copy of the claim form and judgment.
they told me that I had to email them to request this and it was £10 fee per document. That was on Tuesday.

as of today I’ve not got a reply back from the court as to how to proceed which is frustrating .

i was going to wait to get the documents from the court but can I contact the claimants solicitors in the meantime and tell them what I intend to do and give them the 7 days notice?

[jaguarsuk]

Here’s an update . I contacted the county court and asked for a copy of the claim form and judgment.
they told me that I had to email them to request this and it was £10 fee per document. That was on Tuesday.

as of today I’ve not got a reply back from the court as to how to proceed which is frustrating .

i was going to wait to get the documents from the court but can I contact the claimants solicitors in the meantime and tell them what I intend to do and give them the 7 days notice?

Yes you can contact them if you wish and ask for their consent for a set aside.

[blakey1152]

It’s been a week and a half since I emailed the court and have yet to get a reply. Is there any other way of getting a copy of the court order that I need?

i can’t get to Basildon court easily so turning up there isn’t an option as it Turns out it’s nearly a two hour train journey each way and would cost me £25 in fares!!!

[jaguarsuk]

It’s been a week and a half since I emailed the court and have yet to get a reply. Is there any other way of getting a copy of the court order that I need?

i can’t get to Basildon court easily so turning up there isn’t an option as it Turns out it’s nearly a two hour train journey each way and would cost me £25 in fares!!!

The wheels of the court do not turn quickly.

[blakey1152]

I finally got an e-mail reply back from his solicitors after sending them a copy of my N56.
I'm not particularly happy with the response - as follows

I have now considered and discussed your completed form N56 with my client. If your income is £3021.00 per month and your monthly expenditure is £2593.00 this would leave you with £428.00 per month. It appears you already have two county court judgments against you and are paying £100.00 per month towards them and you have credit debts of £42.00 per month. This would leave £286.00 per month.

However I have pointed out to my client that you failed to pay him any rent on xxxxxxxx from March 2017 up until you vacated the property on 2 November 2017. Therefore from March to November 2017 your disposable income would have been £1486.00 given that your current rent is now £1200.00 per month. Further prior to March 2017 your disposable income would have been £886.00 given that the rent you paid to my client was £600.00 per month. Considering this it is not unreasonable for me to have advised my client that you must have savings that you could now use to pay off this County Court Judgment my client has now obtained.

My client is still open to considering a reduction of the £500.00 per month payments set by the court. However this is likely to be on the basis that a lump sum is paid to him first to clear the majority of the debt.

I have advised my client not to agree to a suspended order given the lack of communication and co-operation by you to this firm, my client and the court to date. My client needs certainty that the judgment in his favour will be paid in full with no further action to be taken by him.


Firstly, the reply assumes that I have savings - which I don't - and this is stated on the N56 that I sent them as well.
Can they say that I MUST have savings - without any documentary proof?

Secondly, I vacated the property on October 7th not November 2nd

It seems they've ignored what I've put on the N56 and made their own assumptions.

Should I still carry on with the set aside route?
Thankyou
B

[jaguarsuk]

Firstly, the reply assumes that I have savings - which I don't - and this is stated on the N56 that I sent them as well.
Can they say that I MUST have savings - without any documentary proof?

Secondly, I vacated the property on October 7th not November 2nd

It seems they've ignored what I've put on the N56 and made their own assumptions.

Should I still carry on with the set aside route?
Thankyou
B

Why did you send the N56 when in post #5 I told you this wasn't your best course of action?

The problem with set aside now is that by offering to vary the order you have basically admitted the debt and that could prove problematic. If you asked them for consent when sending the letter to them then you should take this to be ignoring that request.

If you wish to proceed with an application to set aside then you will have to file and pay the fee for it. I'd imagine they will appear at the hearing and if you lose you'll be in the hole for the solicitor costs of dealing with the application. The cost of filing the application will be £255 and only recoverable if you are successful.

I think you need to weigh up what you are potentially going to achieve by setting the judgement aside as if you lose the claim after that then you're right back to square one. It seems £600 of the debt is incorrect if you moved a month earlier than they have claimed, so you have to weigh up the risk versus the reward.

[blakey1152]

Unfortunately. I had already sent the solicitors the N56 before l saw your post about it not being the best course of action.

ive just got home and found a letter from the court with a date for a redetermination hearing in October

Which is way too far away so effectively I am totally screwed here .ive already not paid my council tax for June because of this. The council won’t wait til October!

Thankyou for all your help so far
B

[jaguarsuk]

Unfortunately. I had already sent the solicitors the N56 before l saw your post about it not being the best course of action.

ive just got home and found a letter from the court with a date for a redetermination hearing in October

Which is way too far away so effectively I am totally screwed here .ive already not paid my council tax for June because of this. The council won’t wait til October!

Thankyou for all your help so far
B

So you are not paying your council tax to pay the judgement?